The Yells, George, Mushroom et al thread

[Richinns]

I think we are all getting a little bit tired of every thread being hijacked into discussions with the posters listed above so perhaps we can use this one to discuss investments, part time, budgets etc etc that these guys are so keen to educate us on and therefore leaving the other topics available to discuss relating to the actual title of the thread!

[Gullscorer]

Rich more often than not I find myself agreeing with your comments and opinions when it comes to all things Plainmoor.

But not this one.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion, providing they're not seriously abusive or threatening (I can cope with offensive), but if you don't agree with what they say, the best way to deal with them is to respond with superior arguments of your own, reasoned, logical and cogent, and not to try and side-line them, still less to silence or censor them or to try to shame them into submission. That approach would lead to a slow death for the forum.

Lively debate and discussion and disagreement are what we need, not an echo chamber of agreements.

[Richinns]

I think you are misunderstanding the intention of this thread gullscorer. This thread is a place for that debate rather than hijacking other threads so that the topic of the thread becomes insignificant. Just look at the Ajala thread for the clearest example of this.

[Georg]

Ive not even made a post in the ajala thread.

[Dazza]

Totally agree Rich. These people are high jacking this website for their own personal agendas.

[Gullscorer]

I've looked again at the Ajala thread Rich and I agree it veered somewhat off-topic. I also agree that the comments of those you complain about are not, shall I say, of the highest quality! Which, of course, may well form our opinions of the posters themselves.

But threads do occasionally go off-topic, and in this case I disagree it was entirely by their design, or as a consequence of their posting. It simply happened, and it takes two to tango! But even if such was their intention, I stand by my earlier comment as to the best way to deal with these posters: by superior argument and logic and presentation of facts.

My own view is that, whatever you may think of them, they have not, as yet, posted anything to justify stronger action being taken against them. It is not sufficient to dislike the posters or to abhor their opinions. Rather, it is better to try to persuade them with argument and debate.

[chunkygull]

How do we actually know they are trouble or agents of darkness, I have not actually seen any proof of this and I read absolutely every word on the forum.

There is a lot of veiled comment and wink wink, nudge nudge, possibly riddles or half statements. Then again it was like that on here from a few regular, reliable posters who are in the know when the old board were in. Many a post in those days that had half a comment or story or such and such is bad for TUFC,so and so is an idiot, but never just coming out with it, but never a reason given or answer why. Always a bit we know something you dont know, and we aint gonna tell ya.

Im not bothered by anything these new posters say, all they are gulity of is the timing that they joined and they post some cryptic stuff and possibly things others might not want to read. If they are up to anything I cant see what they are posting on here makes a difference. Would posting on here get anyone a foothold into the club, I doubt it, is there that much gain to be made out of TUFC, I doubt it. What about Plainmoor, the land might be worth a bit, but really worth a lot of hassle. would the land be worth that much, who wants to build at a shithole like Plainmoor anyway? To be honest it did liven the forum up for a bit, it gave us a bit more content to read and a bit of intrigue. So let them post what they like, genuine or not, I dont get why some are getting so steamed.

[Dazza]

Persuade them of what Goalscorer? That's the problem it's the other way round. They are on here to persuade you to abandon the Club to them...

[Gullscorer]

Persuade them of what Goalscorer? That's the problem it's the other way round. They are on here to persuade you to abandon the Club to them...

Are they really? Well, they've not been very successful, have they? Are you so weak-willed that you cannot send these jokers packing with a convincing argument or indisputable fact? And, if nothing else, their own posts will show them up for what they are, for all the world to see. If they are what you think they are, to simply kick them off the field of play is not the answer. Argue and debate. That's what the forum is all about.

[Jerry]

How do we actually know they are trouble or agents of darkness, I have not actually seen any proof of this and I read absolutely every word on the forum.

There is a lot of veiled comment and wink wink, nudge nudge, possibly riddles or half statements. Then again it was like that on here from a few regular, reliable posters who are in the know when the old board were in. Many a post in those days that had half a comment or story or such and such is bad for TUFC,so and so is an idiot, but never just coming out with it, but never a reason given or answer why. Always a bit we know something you dont know, and we aint gonna tell ya.

Im not bothered by anything these new posters say, all they are gulity of is the timing that they joined and they post some cryptic stuff and possibly things others might not want to read. If they are up to anything I cant see what they are posting on here makes a difference. Would posting on here get anyone a foothold into the club, I doubt it, is there that much gain to be made out of TUFC, I doubt it. What about Plainmoor, the land might be worth a bit, but really worth a lot of hassle. would the land be worth that much, who wants to build at a shithole like Plainmoor anyway? To be honest it did liven the forum up for a bit, it gave us a bit more content to read and a bit of intrigue. So let them post what they like, genuine or not, I dont get why some are getting so steamed.

Speak to Hereford supporters about the very similar thing that happened on their forum. The aim is to sow disharmony amongst the supporters and feed discontent with the board so they will be pressurised into accepting investment from people who may not have the best interests of the club at heart.

We even had a similar situation during the Roberts era. Anyone remember "Birminghamgull" who appeared and made a series of posts criticising the trust and supportive of Roberts stadium plans. He was eventually "outed" as Bryn Walker, one of Roberts' advisors.

No money to be made from Plainmoor?

Here's a scenario for you:

Plainmoor is right next door to a school with no room to grow and where the pupils have to traipse all the way up to Quinta for their sports fields. Those same fields are a prime site for redevelopment.

So you get your hands on Plainmoor and offer to let the school have the land in exchange for the rights to the Quinta site.

Added in 5 minutes 10 seconds:

Are they really? Well, they've not been very successful, have they? Are you so weak-willed that you cannot send these jokers packing with a convincing argument or indisputable fact? And, if nothing else, their own posts will show them up for what they are, for all the world to see. If they are what you think they are, to simply kick them off the field of play is not the answer. Argue and debate. That's what the forum is all about.

Who has asked for them to be "kicked off the field of play"? Rich just suggested keeping posts concerning investment to one thread to make the forum tidier. The whole point of a threaded forum is so that people can choose to read subjects that interest them without having to wade through stuff they don't want to read.

And how do you know how successful they have been? There are far more people who read this site than post on it. If something keeps being repeated then a certain proportion of people will believe it no matter how ludicrous. I expect there are even people who believe some of your more outlandish claims.

[chunkygull]

Absolutely see where you are coming from but I cant see what they are doing making that much difference. Bollocks to them should be the attitude from all if they do have an agenda.

To be fair I've had people telling me for 28.5 years that I'm a **** for supporting Torquay United and I shouldnt bother and I'm wasting my time, it hasnt put me off yet, despite the club doing its damnest at times to push me and most of its hardcore fanbase away I am sure it never will.

[Gullscorer]

If something keeps being repeated then a certain proportion of people will believe it no matter how ludicrous. I expect there are even people who believe some of your more outlandish claims.

Yes. Goebbels knew all about that, and certain politicians and pressure groups do the same today. I've tried to warn against them (and the people influenced and hoodwinked by them) on the Popside Forum. If you think I'm being outlandish, try telling that to all the men who've committed suicide as a result of their actions: http://www.cotwa.info/2015/10/a-nationa ... g-man.html

Sorry. Gone off-topic. Your fault..

[Yellows]

I think we are all getting a little bit tired of every thread being hijacked into discussions with the posters listed above so perhaps we can use this one to discuss investments, part time, budgets etc etc that these guys are so keen to educate us on and therefore leaving the other topics available to discuss relating to the actual title of the thread!

Dangerous tackle on Democracy Richinns
"the ​belief in ​freedom and equality between ​people"
Straight Red!

[Kit_robin]

How about the freedom for the rest of us to talk about stuff without you turning the conversation to the same topic? We have about 6 threads basically discussing the same stuff now.

[Gullscorer]

How about the freedom for the rest of us to talk about stuff without you turning the conversation to the same topic? We have about 6 threads basically discussing the same stuff now.

I counted seven threads: Fans' Forum, Statement of Affairs, Dear Asset Strippers, Will Nicho Keep us up this Season?, Great Appointment, Ajala, and Cox Resigns. And yes, all these threads included the same topic. But the first three of the aforementioned threads legitimately included or were about that topic, which also had an understandable association with the other four threads.

The problem, as others have pointed out, is that the relatively new posters under discussion, idiotic and/or mischief-making as they may or may not be, have been continuously harping on the same theme to an extent which has become irritating to a number of other members of the forum. (They have nevertheless made a few useful comments amongst the dross).

The question is, how to deal with and respond to this situation in a way which satisfies all, given that all members, even new ones, have a right to raise issues, make comments, and even to go off-topic to some extent. The answer is either to ignore them, or to respond with superior argument, facts, or questions which require them to add substance to their comments. But not to lower ourselves to the level of name-calling and personal abuse, nor to advocate any kind of censorship or rigid partitioning. This forum and its members should be big enough and flexible enough to handle all issues without resorting to that.

And, given time and experience, the newcomers may become more used to the general style and tone of debate on the forum, and even get to make some truly useful and interesting contributions. After all, that's what I did..