Academy yes or no

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Dave
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Post by Dave »

Motorman, yes, I/we get every word of what you're saying, but please someone find god and get him to give me some strength, no matter how big a shame and loss the closure of the youth set-up is to TUFC.

the club simply could not afford to keep it running, what part of that do some not understand !!!

By the way motorman, I wish your son all the best in finding a new club.

Added in 3 minutes 13 seconds:
dcorbs wrote:This reply is forevertufc.
My son is now left without a club, without a scholarship and without any education in place for next year. he was due to start his scholarship in less than 2 weeks and he has been dumped on from a great height. As for money, I have spent a fortune driving up and down the country for him to play for Torquay United yet they have not even had the decency to write or phone him to let him know. this has been really fair on a 15 year old boy who has just been trying to concentrate on his exams with all of this going on. What ever way you look at it, it is WRONG and there has been no help from the club for my son or the others in the same position. Also I could tell you lots of things about your club which would make you shat yourself!!
Please tell me something about my club I do not already know. Yes I do feel sorry for all the lads, but as said, the previous board should not of given assurances, it is their fault.
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stevegull
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Post by stevegull »

forevertufc wrote:Steve it's the only way, no matter how poor. £250,000 would have be the actual cost to the club to retain a cat 3 status, £100,000 for a cat 4 set-up, if we want a competitive first team, how else ? who was going to fund it ?

Completely understand where you're coming from, and I obviously don't have a view of the club's finance - which clearly must be dire!

However, I have always wondered why TUST ruled out any involvement in the future youth structure. Sure, category 3 is unsustainable but now we've closed the academy twice we won't ever be allowed to reopen it. Ever.
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Post by PhilGull »

Regardless of the decision to close the academy (which I will begrudgingly admit probably was the correct decision) it is somewhat disappointing to be seeing all of these parents posting on here, all saying the same thing - that their kids have simply been told to do one. I realise that fault ultimately lies with the previous board but some offer of help or support in finding a new club would have at least been a gesture of goodwill. The things these parents are saying does nothing to help with PR for a 'community club'.
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Post by Richinns »

stevegull wrote:
Completely understand where you're coming from, and I obviously don't have a view of the club's finance - which clearly must be dire!

However, I have always wondered why TUST ruled out any involvement in the future youth structure. Sure, category 3 is unsustainable but now we've closed the academy twice we won't ever be allowed to reopen it. Ever.
I suspect TUST want to fund their way onto the current board but that is just a guess.

Added in 3 minutes 7 seconds:
PhilGull wrote:Regardless of the decision to close the academy (which I will begrudgingly admit probably was the correct decision) it is somewhat disappointing to be seeing all of these parents posting on here, all saying the same thing - that their kids have simply been told to do one. I realise that fault ultimately lies with the previous board but some offer of help or support in finding a new club would have at least been a gesture of goodwill. The things these parents are saying does nothing to help with PR for a 'community club'.
I completely agree with your sentiment but who provides this or has the expertise to help with this? I suspect all the current energies are going into getting the club ready for the start of the season. Bearing in mind pre-season starts in just over two weeks and (just on the playing front alone) we have nine registered players I think every second these guys currently have is being absorbed by facing this challenge.
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Post by tomogull »

PhilGull wrote:Regardless of the decision to close the academy (which I will begrudgingly admit probably was the correct decision) it is somewhat disappointing to be seeing all of these parents posting on here, all saying the same thing - that their kids have simply been told to do one. I realise that fault ultimately lies with the previous board but some offer of help or support in finding a new club would have at least been a gesture of goodwill. The things these parents are saying does nothing to help with PR for a 'community club'.
One of the posts on here stated (quote) "the club didn't have the decency to write or phone" (about the closure of the Youth Scheme). That can't be blamed on the previous administration. The Youth Academy has now been shut down twice (first time under Mike Bateson). It could conceivably start up again in the future, but what parents in their right senses would want their lad to come to a club with a background of the Acedemy clsing twice ??
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Post by Motorman »

Evening , I am positive that that Dean, The Football League Education and even the old coaches are doing everything they can to help all the boys
But it's a place of work for the boys they need to be happy with what's available, it's not a case of signing for the 1st team that says yes
It requires careful consideration , location, accommodation , opportunity , they don't want to sign for someone just finish the education and be stuck on the bench every week

I really hope the Dean and the new people turn the club around as it has a place In my heart
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Post by Dave »

stevegull wrote:
Completely understand where you're coming from, and I obviously don't have a view of the club's finance - which clearly must be dire!

However, I have always wondered why TUST ruled out any involvement in the future youth structure. Sure, category 3 is unsustainable but now we've closed the academy twice we won't ever be allowed to reopen it. Ever.
I do not the intimate details of the clubs finances either, but, when Steve Breed says the club was close to having the chains wrapped around the front door, I can only read between the lines and realise the club was in deep, deep trouble.

You of course may know more about the relegations regards youth academies than I do. However I am a qualified youth development coach (local level)in my own right, anyone on this forum who's done level 1,2 and the new youth module 1,2 that support those qualifications, will tell you, one of the things drummed into you right from the start is; football is for all.

For the that reason I do not see TUFC being topped from re-opening an academy some time down the line if it chose to do so, yes, I could see their perhaps being some restrictions on funding, but again, under the F.A's own banner of "football for all" that does not punish the club, but the kids trying to play football, so I do see it.
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Post by Richinns »

Tobebythesea wrote:What I don't think people understand is that Dean Edwards and Steve Breed have no interest in running an Academy, money or no money. It is blindingly obvious that Dean Edwards wants to kick our way out of the league and an Academy which places an emphasis on playing from the back and keeping the ball on the ground isn't going to produce the type of player he wants at the club. He may keep harking on about old fashioned values but I watched every home game for well over a decade during the period he was playing and apart from a few laughs under Cyril Knowles it was total sh*t.

At least we have now got rid of our useless Commercial Manager! I've a funny feeling Paul Devlin knows more about football in his little finger than our new Director of Football has in his entire body, so why isn't he Director of Football and Deano head of TUFCFItc? Seems to make more sense to anyone with more than half a brain. Oh no, he's "saved the club" please don't criticise him. Let's also compare the CV of Steve Breed and that of the Chairman of newly relegated Tranmere.

Tranmere - Mark Palios, ex pro footballer, chartered accountant, senior partner at PwC, Football Association Chief Executive, non-exec director of AdEPT Tekecom, member of Surrey County Cricket Audit Committee.

Torquay - Steve Breed, ran a coach to away matches, has a small care agency business, rides a moped.

Who would you back? Well, at least Steve is 'passionate'. No wonder Deano is looking worried.
Oh dear. Who needs enemies with fans like you!
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Post by Dave »

Unless, Rich, it's another disgruntled parent of course. My advice to all parents from the U18's is; you've two ways of dealing with this, you can either sit around moaning feeling sorry for yourselves, or you could actually do something about the situation. Like e-mailing your sons details around to every academy in the country.

After all, if your sons good enough, he will get taken on by another club, if he's not, he won't. Even at this late stage.
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Post by Motorman »

Mr Legend. Ours sons are still under contract and will be paid for 12 months provided with coaching and football by TUFC regardless

If they want them off the TUFC payroll they really need to find suitable alternatives

Show a little respect
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Post by tomogull »

forevertufc wrote:Unless, Rich, it's another disgruntled parent of course. My advice to all parents from the U18's is; you've two ways of dealing with this, you can either sit around moaning feeling sorry for yourselves, or you could actually do something about the situation. Like e-mailing your sons details around to every academy in the country.

After all, if your sons good enough, he will get taken on by another club, if he's not, he won't. Even at this late stage.
Okay, okay, okay - it's really easy to spout off when you're not involved, isn't it ? I have no connection whatsoever with the Youth set up but I do have a fifteen year old grandson at a crucial stage in his education. The personal stories we have read on this thread brings the reality home - these youngsters will have to uproot and TRY to find another Youth Academy (which I suspect won't be as easy as you suggest 'even at this late stage' as most Academies will have filled their scholarship places by now) at a crucial time in their education. You state that a Cat 4 Academy would cost £100,000. How accurate is that figure, or is it just a convenient figure plucked from thin air? If accurate, can it be trimmed in any way? In another post, you say that of course the Academy can be re-started in the future. Yes, of course it can - but would you trust a son to TUFC after the Academy has failed twice ? I don't think so !

The consortium has obviously had to make some difficult and painful decisions and probably the closing of the Academy is the most controversial. I just wonder if an appeal for sponsorship plus help from TUST plus a trimming of your figure of £100,000 could have resulted in a Cat 4 Academy continuing. Obviously, I don't know. It would be interesting to know how many other Conference/National clubs manage to run Category 3 or 4 Academies.
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Post by Dave »

Tommo, I can assure my figure quoted is as accurate as you're going to get, and not one plucked from anywhere, and it's because we were relegated from the football league if I've understood it correctly. Where the funding received as posted elsewhere does an about face, so CAT 3 funding goes from 2/3 rds to 1/3rd, and so on.

So cat 3 cost of roughly £360,000 as quoted elsewhere, would mean our club having to find £250,000 from it's own money, that's what I'm getting at.

EDIT, sorry tommo, forgot to add, yes parents would allow their children to join, if, and it is, an if, TUFC tried to re-start the academy, different families, different generation of young players.

Added in 57 minutes 19 seconds:
Motorman wrote:Mr Legend. Ours sons are still under contract and will be paid for 12 months provided with coaching and football by TUFC regardless

If they want them off the TUFC payroll they really need to find suitable alternatives

Show a little respect
What respect are we talking about here, the scant, and scandalous lack of respect that's been shown by some, towards Steve Breed, Dean Edwards and the consortium that's stepped in and saved our club from 100% almost certainly entering into administration, which in turn would have led to the youth set-up closing any way, which I.Q challenged people can not or fail to understand.

If your sons are going to continued being paid and continued to be provided with training, what actually is the problem, why are so many parents on here moaning. Their are literally 100's if not more lads every year, in academies up and down the country who called into an office at U16 or at the end of their scholarships and told their dream is over, it is the most harsh and unforgiving environment a young person can be in.

My own son was called into an office at Plainmoor as a U14, no compassion, no heart, told by the club they were letting him go, no moans or tears, I gave him some options, he choose to join a specialised goalkeeping academy and was more than happy to pay the £30 a month cost, he worked hard, a year later was rewarded with a trial at Exeter City, my son broke his wrist on his second trial session, and another door slammed shut in his face, he still didn't whinge, despite his bad luck and another plié of crap being flung in his face, he's continued to work his nuts off, just completed his first full season in the S-D-L premier 16-17 years old, winning the clubs first team player of the year, already has two semi-pro clubs tracking him and was invited to train with one, his chances of making it as a pro now, have all but gone with some really poor luck a long the way, but I have no doubt he'll get his reward and earn money playing the game, all because neither of us dripped like a leaky tap, he took his medicine and got on with it, unlike some who've posted on this thread

I will be quoting a post made elsewhere as soon as enough time has elapsed, some would do well to read and understand it.
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Post by Kernowgull »

I really don't understand all this academy stuff anyway. When I was playing youth football, me and my mates all played for local teams, and we had a great time. The good and bad all played for local teams, the better players, two from my team, went off for trials with clubs (Blackburn amongst others) but still played for their local teams with their mates. Only one player from my age group from the whole league, which used to be called the DJM league (Devon junior minor, I believe) made it, and that was Luke McCormick. These days it seems anyone who can pass a ball suddenly thinks they can be a professional. I know it's all about improving standards and making the national team stronger, but seriously, just enjoy playing footy, have a laugh, make some friends, if you really are good enough, you'll get picked up, if you're not, which 99.9% of these lads won't be, you won't have wasted 10 years to get heartbroken, you'll just get a job like the rest of us.
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Post by A Realist »

Tobebythesea wrote:What I don't think people understand is that Dean Edwards and Steve Breed have no interest in running an Academy, money or no money. It is blindingly obvious that Dean Edwards wants to kick our way out of the league and an Academy which places an emphasis on playing from the back and keeping the ball on the ground isn't going to produce the type of player he wants at the club. He may keep harking on about old fashioned values but I watched every home game for well over a decade during the period he was playing and apart from a few laughs under Cyril Knowles it was total sh*t.

At least we have now got rid of our useless Commercial Manager! I've a funny feeling Paul Devlin knows more about football in his little finger than our new Director of Football has in his entire body, so why isn't he Director of Football and Deano head of TUFCFItc? Seems to make more sense to anyone with more than half a brain. Oh no, he's "saved the club" please don't criticise him. Let's also compare the CV of Steve Breed and that of the Chairman of newly relegated Tranmere.

Tranmere - Mark Palios, ex pro footballer, chartered accountant, senior partner at PwC, Football Association Chief Executive, non-exec director of AdEPT Tekecom, member of Surrey County Cricket Audit Committee.

Torquay - Steve Breed, ran a coach to away matches, has a small care agency business, rides a moped.

Who would you back? Well, at least Steve is 'passionate'. No wonder Deano is looking worried.
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Post by Motorman »

Mr legend , I am not weeping like a tap

We are not talking about some schoolboy training , your boy would have continued his education the day after being released, however I understand it would have really been uncomfortable for him and the family for a period of time , really glad he continued with his football

We signed a contract for a two year apprenticeship with TUFC , the contract has been broken as they cannot fulfil the youth team games

They will have to supply a suitable alternative whilst providing coaching , education, food and lodgings

Unfortunately the younger boys who had not yet started will find it more difficult to find something at this late stage

Not showing any disrespect to anyone , just a parent at the end of the day
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