The 5 year plan . . .

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Post by Trojan 67 »

Southampton Gull wrote:Somehow I really don't think that certain Directors are looking forward to League One football.....................


Oi ! No ! :red:

That brings back bad memories of 1967/68 season when our end of season collapse saw us blow the chance of our first ever experience of Division 2 (now the Championship).

The gates at Plainmoor slowly but surely started to drop after that and all because many were convinced that the directors of the time supposedly didn't want promotion because "we couldn't afford it".

The damage was done. At the end of '68, O'Farrell was gone and the break up of the team that Frank built had begun.

What ever the attitude, so is the response. History will repeat itself unless the attitude in the boardroom is anything other that united and positive for League One football.
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Post by Glostergull »

Trojan 67 wrote:

Oi ! No ! :red:

That brings back bad memories of 1967/68 season when our end of season collapse saw us blow the chance of our first ever experience of Division 2 (now the Championship).

The gates at Plainmoor slowly but surely started to drop after that and all because many were convinced that the directors of the time supposedly didn't want promotion because "we couldn't afford it".

The damage was done. At the end of '68, O'Farrell was gone and the break up of the team that Frank built had begun.

What ever the attitude, so is the response. History will repeat itself unless the attitude in the boardroom is anything other that united and positive for League One football.
Are we not behaving a bit previous here. We haven't really a clue on what the boards attitude is to promotion. Have any of us been privvy to any board meetings where Promotion and it's consequences been discussed. I doubt it, Yet here we are again doubting the boards ability to want to gain promotion or even stay up if promoted.
The last collapse was lamentable but it has been and will forever only be heresay and conjecture as to why we blew it. Rumours abound and still abound about the reasons all those years ago and still rear their ugly heads as to why we failed when in such a good position. '
They still have not gone away and unfortunatly I doubt they ever will, I can only think that Brucies dad or young Brucie was around then.
But one thing does remain.
The present board is here to stay.
They set out a 5 year plan
They have more than achieved that 5 year plan and if they do go up then the plan is well ahead.
We have no idea what the board thinks now.
I doubt we will ever have a real idea of what the board thinks now.
The board is a completly new board from all previous boards
You lot still think that despite all this ever member of Torquay United's Board automaticaly gets this odd desease where they suddenly get afflicted with we can't afford to go up.
WE DO NOT KNOW WHAT THEY THINK. SO DON'T BURY EM YET!

One or two facts do remain that affect us going up.
Bigger attendances are not gauranteed. I have seen larger average season crowds for relegation battles than I have for this last 4 years success on and off the pitch. and the lack of bums on seats at the moment is worrying.
We have a long term plan which may take years to put our club back in the memory of the townsfolk who think we died years ago.
This plan is based on very hard work which must not be let up and the grind will get us down sometimes but it has to happen.
When this work is starting to reap it's harvest it will still take a while to take our gates up to what they should be.
we are also working agains't a long term decline of the area where intsead of working families we have an aging population and an ever increasing largess of the unemplyed who take the attititude of if we can't or won't work why not do it in an area where we can live with great scenery. I do know some of those I am talking about personaly.
We also have a few prevailing attitudes among our own fans where they want the board to change who stands where and when. so that they can go in the present away end yet still have their drinkies at half time.
That's a bit like saying not what can I do for the country but what can the country do for me.
We should be saying to the board.
What can we do to max our crowds for every fixture and be flexible as to whom stands where each and every match. so that if we can only gaurantee 3,000 fans every match the rest will have to come from away fans if the oportunity arises. if that means we give the away stand or the whole of Bristows bench to away fans then so be it. If we have to give the away fans half the ground then so be it. we cannot afford to pansy about. the money does have to come in, don't get too worried about how it comes in just get it in. Bums on seats. who's doesn't matter, but bums on seats.
It's been worrying and very disapointing that of the three main matches this season, only one of them has given rise to an attendance of more than 4,000. that's awfull. and the other two were below that. we should have said how many do you want to bring and then set about telling our fans that we want promotion then the pop side will be needed for away fans for this one day. Let them pay for our promotion. Don't let your set attitudes lose us money.
Flippin eckythump. If they asked me to climb the tree outside so they could get one more fan in Plaimoor I would. anything to see us where we want to be. I would sit on the roof of Bristows bench if it raised a few quid more. I would sit there worrying about not having a half time drink. There's plenty of time after for that. Lets get the money if from them thar away supporters and blow the temp discomfort.
Now the real question should be
NOT WHAT CAN THE CLUB DO FOR US, BUT WHAT CAN WE DO FOR THE CLUB!!
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Post by the_shredder »

Hmm some good points indeed glostergull.

Can someone tell me as i am a bit naive in this department, but why would going up to league 1 have to cost us more money? Sure it would be great to pour more money into the team to give us a better chance of staying up - but we don't HAVE to do that? Surely the best way to ensure we aren't fending off League 2 relegation next year is to be in league 1, even if we don't spend a penny more on wages or team costs in general and end up coming right back down - isn't there some sort of prize money for promotion, and then we have higher away crowds, and probably some more home fans too... i'm failing to see what compulsory costs will outweigh this?

Also i think something needs to be done about the ticket price versus average person's budget, because £17 is enough for some people to put food and drink on the table for themself for a week, put that versus 2 hours of footy and it is simply a bad personal choice regardless of love for the club, for people on a budget. An offer such as 5 friends for £50 and suddenly i'm thinking "who can i drag along with me" but there is no and i mean NO chance in hell of being able to tempt any of my friends into the TUFC experience at £17 a pop, and then hope that we win to entice them back. a 5 for £50 offer would ensure that people coming for the first time will have 4 friends there for a better atmosphere, and they won't have to shell out so much to give it a go.

Some might say we'd lose money, maybe we would maybe we wouldn't, but the long-term gain of a new fan is not quantifiable and at the end of the day - we won't actually know unless we try it 1 time. I'd like to see SOMETHING being tried/experimented to boost attendance/lower costs the £10 membership was never going to do this.
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Post by Southampton Gull »

Glostergull wrote:
Are we not behaving a bit previous here. We haven't really a clue on what the boards attitude is to promotion. Have any of us been privvy to any board meetings where Promotion and it's consequences been discussed. I doubt it, Yet here we are again doubting the boards ability to want to gain promotion or even stay up if promoted.
Who said anything about the Board and their attitude? Kindly read the posts properly and then you might understand what was actually written.
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Post by Dave »

No one has questioned the board attitude towards promotion on this thread, of course the current board are not going to turn down the chance for promotion, however I do agree with Dave S/G , I think there is no doubt that the current board may well be some what nervous about promotion.

And that will be down to costs, some of our players may or may not have promotion clauses in thier contracts, and if they don't I am sure they will join the que outside the managers office asking for a pay rise, thier is also a number of games next season should we be in league 1 that would require extra policing at the club's cost, increased income would barely cover this, and thier is no way of knowing whether our gates would rise.

I think if in league 1 next term, it would be a case of Martin Ling working off a bottom 4 budget, and he will have to work some majic to keep us up their.
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Post by Trojan 67 »

My own take on the 1967/68 season is that the collapse in form and the missing out of promotion was just one of those things that happen in football, and nothing whatsoever to do with "we can't afford to go up".

I say to those who experienced it, do really believe Frank O'Farrell and his good squad of players would "throw it" to appease the supposed "we can't afford to go up" attitude ?

If we go up this season it will be similar to the last two occasions we went up under one man band show Mike Bateson . . . we would be on a restricted budget and in the words of Dinger, "We'd 'ave to pull more wabbits aht the 'at than we've pulled aht nah."

If we go up, I believe the infrastructure and will is there to make a better fist of it. If we've gone up and come straight back down then so be it.

It appears the club has another 5 year plan in mind . . .

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Post by Glostergull »

Southampton Gull wrote: Who said anything about the Board and their attitude? Kindly read the posts properly and then you might understand what was actually written.
I did read the post correctly young man. (Well Youngish compared to us dinosaurs) If I was a member of the board and you said to me what you wrote on here I would have taken it that you were questioning whether I wanted promotion . You can put what interpretation on you like but others will interprate things differently.
That by the way is the idea of a forum. it's not wrong to interprete things differently. just as long as we don't go knocking seven bells out of each other afterward.
There is no escaping the fact that promotion will cost us a lot of money. it would be interesting to know what the relative difference was between old 2nd division and 3 division salary to see what it would have cost 45 years ago and then compare it to the 2004 team. and then compare that to todays team. I have a suspicion that the would be quite a steep curve upward as the filtering down of Premiership attitudes have pushed up salaries today. We just need to adapt if possible and see if we can pull another rabbit out of the hat tomake what we generate do that liittle bit more that our oponants.
One advantage we do have over out oponants is that fact thats we have been small for generations. We are very well practiced at making money stretch as far as is possible. When your income rises you tend to live to that income. And the idea of making money stretch fades into the distance. Plymuff are learning that lesson now. And what they learn will stand them in good stead for a while. But as they rise back up they will forget some of those lessons and there is a danger that they will fall again.
One thing that did make me feel a little pride in our club appeared in the press recently. The new owner of Arglye in talking about providing a new stand to complete the stadium remarked on lessons being learned from up the road. And in mentioning United he pointed out what a well run club can achieve. I thought it was a considered and positive statement about Torquay United from one of our main competitors.
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Post by Southampton Gull »

Southampton Gull wrote:Somehow I really don't think that certain Directors are looking forward to League One football.....................
Glostergull wrote:
Are we not behaving a bit previous here. We haven't really a clue on what the boards attitude is to promotion. Have any of us been privvy to any board meetings where Promotion and it's consequences been discussed. I doubt it, Yet here we are again doubting the boards ability to want to gain promotion or even stay up if promoted.

Spot the difference?

If "certain Directors" share their feelings with several people it will eventually come out into the public domain and make no mistake, "certain Directors" have done just that.

Whether you choose to believe that makes no difference to me at all but please do not attribute something to me when I clearly didn't write it.
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Post by Trojan 67 »

Don't argue with a Dartmouth buhy, even though his moniker these days is Southampton Gull


"Dumb ass".


That wasn't me, honest, that was Jeff Dunham's wooden extension chirping in.


In the words of "Walter", "One pisses me off !"


The other, I have a drink with and we get on just fine. ;-) :nod: :-D
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Post by eastyorksgull »

maybe i am still under in the influence from yesterdays wedding,but surely we can compete in league 1,dont buy into the survival bit,we would be there on our merit,with lingy at the helm,we are at least a mid table league 1 team,ok you are saying your still pissed man,but in my little humble opinion we are more than capable to compete in that league......and then within 5 years a championship team.....ever the eternal optimist i know....enjoy the ride
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