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Post by PhilGull »

Gulliball wrote: For some people we'll earn less than they might otherwise have been prepared to spend, but we only had circa 400 season ticket holders last season and have jumped from that figure to over 1000.

To use my dad as an example, he's been going to Plainmoor for 20 odd years, without ever having a season ticket. He usually goes to somewhere around 18 odd home games a season so it's not worthwhile to him. In the last few years I've noticed that he's been missing more and more games, even when he was able to attend, as the motivation to go just wasn't there. He's bought a season ticket for this year, and will probably attend a lot more games next year as a result. If next season continues as recent years have, and we end up with several Tuesday night fixtures again, then £200 might very easily be more than he would otherwise have spent. At the very least it's filling Plainmoor a lot more each week and this has knock on effects in terms of programmes, food and drink sales etc. It also in turn encourages more people to attend (for example my mum and brother are going to the game tonight and are much more likely to go to a game next season if my dad's there).

With 1000 season tickets, we're not going to have crowds of 1100 and 1200 as we've had in recent years. The die hard fans who have a £200 season ticket will likely contribute to the TUST and/or players fund and from the others you have a £200 commitment from them, which will likely average out at not that far off what would have spent, with the benefit of having them inside the ground more often. After 4 years of decline, getting fans into Plainmoor and experiencing the Nicholson feel good factor can only be a good thing. For the concession rate season tickets, these are the fans of the next 50 years, and along with the magnificent community initiatives we've seen this pre-season, is what gives us a future as a community based small local club.

Overall, I don't think they're going to be a disaster and may well help us to turn the corner from a club in decline to a positive, community engaging club.
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Post by Oh Fer Christ Sake »

Maths no one's strong point, I see.

Sell 400 STs at £300 or 1100 at £200. Which brings in more money? Which guarantees attendance of more people? Which drives greater additional revenue from matchday sales? Which makes punters feel they're getting a better deal?
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Post by Kernowgull »

Gulliball wrote: For some people we'll earn less than they might otherwise have been prepared to spend, but we only had circa 400 season ticket holders last season and have jumped from that figure to over 1000.

To use my dad as an example, he's been going to Plainmoor for 20 odd years, without ever having a season ticket. He usually goes to somewhere around 18 odd home games a season so it's not worthwhile to him. In the last few years I've noticed that he's been missing more and more games, even when he was able to attend, as the motivation to go just wasn't there. He's bought a season ticket for this year, and will probably attend a lot more games next year as a result. If next season continues as recent years have, and we end up with several Tuesday night fixtures again, then £200 might very easily be more than he would otherwise have spent. At the very least it's filling Plainmoor a lot more each week and this has knock on effects in terms of programmes, food and drink sales etc. It also in turn encourages more people to attend (for example my mum and brother are going to the game tonight and are much more likely to go to a game next season if my dad's there).

With 1000 season tickets, we're not going to have crowds of 1100 and 1200 as we've had in recent years. The die hard fans who have a £200 season ticket will likely contribute to the TUST and/or players fund and from the others you have a £200 commitment from them, which will likely average out at not that far off what would have spent, with the benefit of having them inside the ground more often. After 4 years of decline, getting fans into Plainmoor and experiencing the Nicholson feel good factor can only be a good thing. For the concession rate season tickets, these are the fans of the next 50 years, and along with the magnificent community initiatives we've seen this pre-season, is what gives us a future as a community based small local club.

Overall, I don't think they're going to be a disaster and may well help us to turn the corner from a club in decline to a positive, community engaging club.
I have to say that this is a very well put argument. It would be interesting to know the stats, although I don't suppose it's possible to get them, but that 1800 average last season would not have been the same 1800 at each game. For example, my old man goes once a month, I went 6 times last season. I'd say my dad is reasonably regular, but on the 2 to 3 times he doesn't go a month, somebody else goes who wasn't there when he did. I'd wager that although we can say we have a hard-core of 1800, that hard-core is not made up of 1800 individuals. I'd class myself as reasonably hard-core, considering I live over 100 miles away and have never lived closer than an hour away. If our average next season is 1800 then probably 1000 of those will be paying on the gate, 200plus will have a season ticket but not be there, then our paying on the gate crowd will still be bigger than many of our competitors total crowd. Surely that is enough to run the club and be competitive at this level when you factor in Sponsorship and franchises etc?
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Post by Plainmoor78 »

I am not going to criticise the £200 season ticket, but what pisses me off is this. I have never owned a season ticket mainly because my shift patterrns prevent me from attending all but a handful of games a season. When I do go I like to sit in bristows bench. I honestly do not feel the quality of football at this level justifies prices of £19 or £20. In fact I do not think anybody should pay more than £15 for any spot in the ground. But what strikes me is this; if you want to attract more custom from people who rarely or never attend, then surely you would slash the price of individual match day tickets, rather than season tickets which probably only go to regular supporters.
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Post by Burnhamgull »

Southampton Gull wrote: Yes but so far his best has wasted several months courting an inappropriate buyer when there were other offers discarded in favour of GI. As much as I respect his attempts to save the club he has overseen a catalogue of errors going back to the beginning when he and his fellow directors gave Dean Edwards the chance to screw them over.

Probably a nice enough bloke but just as inept as Simon Baker.
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Post by furmax »

Me and my partner are others who have taken up the season ticket this year. At £300 we would not have done. So, as it is the club is better off. This is a gift to the club as we live in Wolverhampton and are unlikely to make many games this season. But we might make more than we would have done. An extra program sold. Extra refreshments. Maybe even a shirt or two.......
And we still keep up our £25 a month to the players fund.

My point is not every season ticket sold is a loss. For everyone that bought one because of the reduced price, pays for 2 others reduction.
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Post by leetufc »

Plainmoor78 wrote:I am not going to criticise the £200 season ticket, but what pisses me off is this. I have never owned a season ticket mainly because my shift patterrns prevent me from attending all but a handful of games a season. When I do go I like to sit in bristows bench. I honestly do not feel the quality of football at this level justifies prices of £19 or £20. In fact I do not think anybody should pay more than £15 for any spot in the ground. But what strikes me is this; if you want to attract more custom from people who rarely or never attend, then surely you would slash the price of individual match day tickets, rather than season tickets which probably only go to regular supporters.
Whilst i can understand your frustrations, we need to charge that much to keep the club afloat as a professional club. As a pro club we need a £400k year wage budget to keep 18-20 footballers in a pro living, plus favtor in travel, ground costs, support staff and its suddenly a lot of money needed over a year to break even and the need to charge what Torquay do. When you factor in that not all fans who attend are paying full price (concessions etc) it is probably an average of less than £15 per head per game.

If we could half the price and double attendance every week i am sure we would, but past initiatives have shown this doesn't happen and we cannot afford to it unfortunately.

And speaking as a fan who does not attend regularly and would consider a loyal supporter, i think the club are right to offer lower prices to those fans who attend regularly and keep the coffers ticking week in week out. That is not to say we should not be looking at ways to also entice in the less regular fans and new fans, but history has shown price offers have not had the desired effect, both in the short or long term.
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Post by PhilGull »

Oh Fer Christ Sake wrote:Maths no one's strong point, I see.

Sell 400 STs at £300 or 1100 at £200. Which brings in more money? Which guarantees attendance of more people? Which drives greater additional revenue from matchday sales? Which makes punters feel they're getting a better deal?
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Post by Southampton Gull »

What about the middle of the winter when all the money from the season ticket sales has gone and we face a period of inactivity due to inclement weather or a few midweek games with low attendances, exactly where is the money going to come from to keep paying the wages and other costs?

This offer, despite good arguments from Gulliball, will cripple us later this season, it's imperative we get some kind of investment from somewhere. History has shown that our crowds won't average the numbers we'll need even if we are successful on the pitch.
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Post by madgull »

Oh Fer Christ Sake wrote:Maths no one's strong point, I see.

Sell 400 STs at £300 or 1100 at £200. Which brings in more money? Which guarantees attendance of more people? Which drives greater additional revenue from matchday sales? Which makes punters feel they're getting a better deal?
Since when has any activity that requires engaging the brain ever been the strong point of most of this forum's membership? :}
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Post by Gullscorer »

madgull wrote: Since when has any activity that requires engaging the brain ever been the strong point of most of this forum's membership? :}
Or of most Devonians.. :)
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Post by Modgull »

Southampton Gull wrote:What about the middle of the winter when all the money from the season ticket sales has gone and we face a period of inactivity due to inclement weather or a few midweek games with low attendances, exactly where is the money going to come from to keep paying the wages and other costs?

This offer, despite good arguments from Gulliball, will cripple us later this season, it's imperative we get some kind of investment from somewhere. History has shown that our crowds won't average the numbers we'll need even if we are successful on the pitch.
:goodpost: This has been my point too. For every person who takes the offer who would otherwise not have attended there will be far more who would either have paid the normal price for a season ticket or would have attended and paid on the gate at an even higher average price. In these cases the season ticket offer represents a substantial cut in the playing budget unless the team can keep average gates well above last year (unlikely but possible I suppose).

Another option is for those who would have been willing to pay more to contribute to the players fund as suggested by Nicho in his letter to season ticket holders. I will definitely be taking this option and hope all other season ticket holders do likewise.
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Post by Jerry »

Modgull wrote: Another option is for those who would have been willing to pay more to contribute to the players fund as suggested by Nicho in his letter to season ticket holders. I will definitely be taking this option and hope all other season ticket holders do likewise.
I was putting £10 per month into the players fund but cancelled this when GI appeared on the scene. I will now be renewing this and adding an extra £10 per month to cover the difference between what I paid for my season ticket and what I paid last year.

Only seems right as I would still have bought one if the price hadn't been slashed.
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Post by Southampton Gull »

Good man, Jerry.
I'm getting two for family members from Dartmouth and they've already committed to the players fund on the back of that.

Phil, you're right to be worried, perhaps it's now or never for us fans to really get behind the club and drag us out of the current mess.
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Post by Colorado Gull »

If we're top of the league and fighting for promotion, then it won't be a problem. Fans like to watch exciting football at any level and if we are near the brink of promotion, then we're laughing, 2,500+ every week towards the end of the season.

The issue will be if it's the alternative. It all comes down to the results, no pressure Nicho, so I guess we all need to do our bit and support the lads at home and away.
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