RE Angus' card, I know my memory isn't that good but I remember the incident exactly as Kev describes it. Angus is having a great season but he was silly yesterday and you could see by his demeanour at the end of the match that he knew he'd been daft. I think we've been hard done by with some of the bookings we've received but not that one.ferrarilover wrote: A) He's under no obligation to return the ball.
B) Your memory is useless, trade it in for a new one at once.
C) You have a bee in your bonnet about our disciplinary record, seeming to blame the players when it's pretty clear to see that we're being harshly treated by officials (as the Gus Mac incident here very clearly shows). Do you have some vested interest in protecting referees and their silly decisions? Are you Mike Riley, or whoever is Referee-in-Chief this week? If so, can I have your autograph please... :~D
Matt.
Torquay United v Wrexham - Saturday 4th October 2014 - 3pm
Taking this back to the MacDonald yellow card, from my position, back step popside near the half way line, my immediate thoughts were, that's a yellow card, so I can not critize the ref, nor am I critizing the ref for booking Angus, although I haven't watched it back on video, so Matt's view may well be right, there has to be an understanding that a referee see's something in a split second and has to make a judgement on that, sometimes they'll get it wrong.
Taking it back now to our teams overall disciplinary record. Last season we rarely got close enough to the ball or the opposition, this season the difference is, we are playing at a lower level, with a very good young passionate team, we seeing a lot possession rather than chasing shadows, sometimes picking up yellow or red cards is just an occupational hazard, example, a defender or goalkeeper finds himself 1.v.1 with an opposition striker , makes a legitimate effort to stop him from scoring, and mistimes the challenge.
For me it's the needless red and yellow cards our team has to stamp out, we can't blame the refs wholeheartedly, we've had 2 needless red cards, a number of needless yellow, and 2nd yellow cards, it goes back to what I've been saying for weeks, individual decision making of players.
And lastly time wasting, this is an issue that really makes my laugh, Wrexham are 1.0 up in tight game, and rightly in my opinion do everything they can to slow the game, and why not, their winning, their right to do so, our fans boo, we shout "get on with it ref" " book him" "cheating tome wasting c''ts"
Luke Young puts us 2.1 up and game is still tight, our team slows it down, and again why not, we're winning is now our right, and our fans are now clapping, cheering, we're shouting" slow it down" "waste time"
It happens everywhere, some refs seem to issue yellows for it, others do not. And yep, time wasting is a subject steeped in so much hypocrisy it's untrue.
Taking it back now to our teams overall disciplinary record. Last season we rarely got close enough to the ball or the opposition, this season the difference is, we are playing at a lower level, with a very good young passionate team, we seeing a lot possession rather than chasing shadows, sometimes picking up yellow or red cards is just an occupational hazard, example, a defender or goalkeeper finds himself 1.v.1 with an opposition striker , makes a legitimate effort to stop him from scoring, and mistimes the challenge.
For me it's the needless red and yellow cards our team has to stamp out, we can't blame the refs wholeheartedly, we've had 2 needless red cards, a number of needless yellow, and 2nd yellow cards, it goes back to what I've been saying for weeks, individual decision making of players.
And lastly time wasting, this is an issue that really makes my laugh, Wrexham are 1.0 up in tight game, and rightly in my opinion do everything they can to slow the game, and why not, their winning, their right to do so, our fans boo, we shout "get on with it ref" " book him" "cheating tome wasting c''ts"
Luke Young puts us 2.1 up and game is still tight, our team slows it down, and again why not, we're winning is now our right, and our fans are now clapping, cheering, we're shouting" slow it down" "waste time"
It happens everywhere, some refs seem to issue yellows for it, others do not. And yep, time wasting is a subject steeped in so much hypocrisy it's untrue.
Formerly known as forevertufc
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ferrarilover
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What gets me isn't the hypocrisy of the fans, it's that I can't recall any non-Torquay player getting booked for it for, well, years. The last three that I can recall are Gus (for getting the ball kicked at him) and Pokey twice. Considering some of the time wasting I've seen in that time, it's daft.
Matt.
Matt.
J5 said, "ferrarilover is 100% correct"
Going back a few pages, another great match report from Swanny. Dave Thomas on the Herald Express better watch out .......
It was a strange sort of game in some ways. It started off well with both teams playing some good football in the first 15 minutes or so and then it went flat and became scrappy until the Wrexham goal. Then it picked up pace again. H & H obviously had a go at the players at half time and sent them out early. We definitely looked more up for it in the second half. Added to Swanny's report, there was also a great shot from Briscoe which was well saved by their 'keeper. He managed to push the ball out. It could easily have fallen to Bowman or Ajala but fell between the two and was scrambled away.
Comment has been made about Cameron having an ineffectual game but some credit has to be given to the Wrexham right back who marked and tackled him very well. I was also impressed with their no. 7 and was surprised but pleased when he was taken off. It could and should have been another clean sheet .......
It was a strange sort of game in some ways. It started off well with both teams playing some good football in the first 15 minutes or so and then it went flat and became scrappy until the Wrexham goal. Then it picked up pace again. H & H obviously had a go at the players at half time and sent them out early. We definitely looked more up for it in the second half. Added to Swanny's report, there was also a great shot from Briscoe which was well saved by their 'keeper. He managed to push the ball out. It could easily have fallen to Bowman or Ajala but fell between the two and was scrambled away.
Comment has been made about Cameron having an ineffectual game but some credit has to be given to the Wrexham right back who marked and tackled him very well. I was also impressed with their no. 7 and was surprised but pleased when he was taken off. It could and should have been another clean sheet .......
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ferrarilover
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Yes, it should.
The goals we have conceded this year have been, for the most part, bloody terrible. We're not forcing the opposition to work for their corn. Two of the three at Gateshead, well, what can you do when a Conference side has a million pound player in their squad? Aldershot's was probably a foul, but we'll give them the benefit of the doubt. Lincoln's was a pen. All four of Telford's were a disaster for us and were hardly a decent reflection on Telford. FGR's first was offside and the second was a foul. Wrexham's was a farce from our POV and, I've read today, not the first time this season that he's done it. We had been warned.
So, of 12 goals conceded, fair and impartial refereeing would have saved us 2 (and earned us an extra 3 points) and proper defending would have saved us 5 (and earned us an extra 3 points).
Alright, four of the five came in one calamitous game, but that's still a piss poor record. We've given away 40% of the goals we have conceded this season for absolutely no reason whatsoever. We can't do anything about naff officiating, we can't do anything about Gateshead having a decent striker, we can't do anything about it when the opposition are just better than we are. What we can affect is what we do, and what we've done all too often this season is gift goals to opponents without them needing to do anything at all to earn them.
I believe the statistics from another thread show that we are made to work extremely hard for all the goals we score, with goalkeepers (statistically at least) performing better against us than against any other side. That's fine. If that's what really happens, then so be it, there's bugger all we can do about it. If we're not making it as hard for the opposition as they are making it for us, then something is amiss.
Chalk up the Telford game to experience and Ricey's mistake as a never-to-be-repeated freak and move on (I know it's tough, especially in the case of Saturday's incident, because he is old enough to know much better than to take such a stupid risk). If it keeps happening, then it is something that will need to be addressed, because young and hungry or not, gifting the opposition goals is NOT going to see us end up where we look more than capable of ending up.
Matt.
The goals we have conceded this year have been, for the most part, bloody terrible. We're not forcing the opposition to work for their corn. Two of the three at Gateshead, well, what can you do when a Conference side has a million pound player in their squad? Aldershot's was probably a foul, but we'll give them the benefit of the doubt. Lincoln's was a pen. All four of Telford's were a disaster for us and were hardly a decent reflection on Telford. FGR's first was offside and the second was a foul. Wrexham's was a farce from our POV and, I've read today, not the first time this season that he's done it. We had been warned.
So, of 12 goals conceded, fair and impartial refereeing would have saved us 2 (and earned us an extra 3 points) and proper defending would have saved us 5 (and earned us an extra 3 points).
Alright, four of the five came in one calamitous game, but that's still a piss poor record. We've given away 40% of the goals we have conceded this season for absolutely no reason whatsoever. We can't do anything about naff officiating, we can't do anything about Gateshead having a decent striker, we can't do anything about it when the opposition are just better than we are. What we can affect is what we do, and what we've done all too often this season is gift goals to opponents without them needing to do anything at all to earn them.
I believe the statistics from another thread show that we are made to work extremely hard for all the goals we score, with goalkeepers (statistically at least) performing better against us than against any other side. That's fine. If that's what really happens, then so be it, there's bugger all we can do about it. If we're not making it as hard for the opposition as they are making it for us, then something is amiss.
Chalk up the Telford game to experience and Ricey's mistake as a never-to-be-repeated freak and move on (I know it's tough, especially in the case of Saturday's incident, because he is old enough to know much better than to take such a stupid risk). If it keeps happening, then it is something that will need to be addressed, because young and hungry or not, gifting the opposition goals is NOT going to see us end up where we look more than capable of ending up.
Matt.
J5 said, "ferrarilover is 100% correct"
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arcadia
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He's an amateur in professional clothing.ferrarilover wrote:Yes, it should.
The goals we have conceded this year have been, for the most part, bloody terrible. We're not forcing the opposition to work for their corn. Two of the three at Gateshead, well, what can you do when a Conference side has a million pound player in their squad? Aldershot's was probably a foul, but we'll give them the benefit of the doubt. Lincoln's was a pen. All four of Telford's were a disaster for us and were hardly a decent reflection on Telford. FGR's first was offside and the second was a foul. Wrexham's was a farce from our POV and, I've read today, not the first time this season that he's done it. We had been warned.
So, of 12 goals conceded, fair and impartial refereeing would have saved us 2 (and earned us an extra 3 points) and proper defending would have saved us 5 (and earned us an extra 3 points).
Alright, four of the five came in one calamitous game, but that's still a piss poor record. We've given away 40% of the goals we have conceded this season for absolutely no reason whatsoever. We can't do anything about naff officiating, we can't do anything about Gateshead having a decent striker, we can't do anything about it when the opposition are just better than we are. What we can affect is what we do, and what we've done all too often this season is gift goals to opponents without them needing to do anything at all to earn them.
I believe the statistics from another thread show that we are made to work extremely hard for all the goals we score, with goalkeepers (statistically at least) performing better against us than against any other side. That's fine. If that's what really happens, then so be it, there's bugger all we can do about it. If we're not making it as hard for the opposition as they are making it for us, then something is amiss.
Chalk up the Telford game to experience and Ricey's mistake as a never-to-be-repeated freak and move on (I know it's tough, especially in the case of Saturday's incident, because he is old enough to know much better than to take such a stupid risk). If it keeps happening, then it is something that will need to be addressed, because young and hungry or not, gifting the opposition goals is NOT going to see us end up where we look more than capable of ending up.
Matt.
Hope he improves.
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Gullscorer
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On the flip side, he has made some very good saves which have no doubt gained us points this season. Being a goalkeeper must surely be the worst position to play. A 'keeper can make a string of brilliant saves and then makes a howler which costs a goal. What is remembered ? The mistake of course. Outfield players can make mistakes which don't lead to goals and are overlooked. Not the poor 'keeper. Martin Rice is not the greatest 'keeper ever to pull on a United jersey but overall he has been okay this season. Not brilliant, but okay .......arcadia wrote: He's an amateur in professional clothing. Hope he improves.
[quote="ferrarilover"
Despite his Oscar winning performance, I'm not sure how badly hurt their keeper was and I certainly don't think the touch of cramp he had at worst warranted a 5 minute delay. The referee had to tell their trainer to come on at least twice before he went to the aid of the amateur dramatist.
Wrexham keeper Daniel Bachmann says he is expected to be out for at least three months with a torn medial collateral ligament in his knee.
Despite his Oscar winning performance, I'm not sure how badly hurt their keeper was and I certainly don't think the touch of cramp he had at worst warranted a 5 minute delay. The referee had to tell their trainer to come on at least twice before he went to the aid of the amateur dramatist.
Wrexham keeper Daniel Bachmann says he is expected to be out for at least three months with a torn medial collateral ligament in his knee.
That's sad news for the player. I thought he looked a competent keeper - Wrexham will miss him.lexusguy wrote:[quote="ferrarilover"
Despite his Oscar winning performance, I'm not sure how badly hurt their keeper was and I certainly don't think the touch of cramp he had at worst warranted a 5 minute delay. The referee had to tell their trainer to come on at least twice before he went to the aid of the amateur dramatist.
Wrexham keeper Daniel Bachmann says he is expected to be out for at least three months with a torn medial collateral ligament in his knee.
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ferrarilover
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Bugger me, that's jolly sad for him. I feel a bit mean now. Wrexham will suffer, he looks a bloody good stopper.lexusguy wrote:[quote="ferrarilover"
Despite his Oscar winning performance, I'm not sure how badly hurt their keeper was and I certainly don't think the touch of cramp he had at worst warranted a 5 minute delay. The referee had to tell their trainer to come on at least twice before he went to the aid of the amateur dramatist.
Wrexham keeper Daniel Bachmann says he is expected to be out for at least three months with a torn medial collateral ligament in his knee.
Matt.
J5 said, "ferrarilover is 100% correct"
He has pulled off some decent saves, but he's also made saves that have had the crowd around me purring, but only looked good because his terrible positioning has meant he has to fly across his goal. I made this point last year also.tomogull wrote: On the flip side, he has made some very good saves which have no doubt gained us points this season. Being a goalkeeper must surely be the worst position to play. A 'keeper can make a string of brilliant saves and then makes a howler which costs a goal. What is remembered ? The mistake of course. Outfield players can make mistakes which don't lead to goals and are overlooked. Not the poor 'keeper. Martin Rice is not the greatest 'keeper ever to pull on a United jersey but overall he has been okay this season. Not brilliant, but okay .......
I am afraid that he was the worst GK I saw in l3ague 2 last year (bar that young guy who played for bury/Rochdale on his debut - who incidentally played for Nuneaton this year and looked better). While he is not the worst conference keeper I've seen so far, he is quite near the bottom. The Nuneaton and Woking goalkeepers looked very inexperienced, but other than that...
You need a good gk to be successful. Not just because of their own errors, but because of the errors they cause in front of them. A central defender who do3snt trust their gk is an accident waiting to happen. We had a spell of dodgy keepers the first conference season and it showed, with poke in the second we looked far better. .
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Gullscorer
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Well, given that we're currently third in the table, he must be doing something right..Kit_robin wrote:He has pulled off some decent saves, but he's also made saves that have had the crowd around me purring, but only looked good because his terrible positioning has meant he has to fly across his goal. I made this point last year also.
I am afraid that he was the worst GK I saw in l3ague 2 last year (bar that young guy who played for bury/Rochdale on his debut - who incidentally played for Nuneaton this year and looked better). While he is not the worst conference keeper I've seen so far, he is quite near the bottom. The Nuneaton and Woking goalkeepers looked very inexperienced, but other than that...
You need a good gk to be successful. Not just because of their own errors, but because of the errors they cause in front of them. A central defender who do3snt trust their gk is an accident waiting to happen. We had a spell of dodgy keepers the first conference season and it showed, with poke in the second we looked far better. .
Well, given that we're currently third in the table, he must be doing something right..[/quote]Gullscorer wrote:
You need a good gk to be successful. Not just because of their own errors, but because of the errors they cause in front of them. A central defender who do3snt trust their gk is an accident waiting to happen. We had a spell of dodgy keepers the first conference season and it showed, with poke in the second we looked far better. .
Achieved nothing yet, my friend!
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