Scoring goals

[Dave]

It's got nothing to do with being selfish or arrogant really. When you have a coaching staff with the experience that owers and Kuhl, have coupled with there playing careers also, what would it say about them if they needed support from consultant coach manager, that's a prelude to the sack.

I have the upmost respect for Sturrock, his professional career, and his achievements speak for themselves, but, what he's posted above is simple basic stuff, that any average level 1/2 coach is going to know, trust me I am one, and did work locally for 10 years as many will know. I know what's posted above and used similar coaching theme's from U15-U18, anybody who thinks our coaching staff don't know that, are the one's bordering between arrogance and stupidity.

There's a heck of a lot less pressure on a coaching staff who have a collection of some the best players available at their level, like Argyle had when scoring 102 goals.

For a start you need the right players, no real point in encouraging your team to swing 20 plus early crosses in the area, if you haven't got a player/players capable of consistently getting the ball into the right areas, because you still aren't going to score goals, there's also no real point in swinging cross after cross into the box, if you don't have a Sill's/Rendell type player, with the consistent ability to make the runs, to get onto the right areas, and finish it off, because you still aren't going to score goals.

That's why I think Luggy makes it sound so simplistic, I mean what happens if the opposition manager, goes with an extra CB, deploys wing backs who are stopping those crosses at source, there is of course less pressure on the training ground.

You can't fully judge Owers and Kruhl yet, they inherited a pile of dog turd, you can only improve things by bringing better players than what you already have, then those players have to available, you can't buy, what's NOT for sale.
They've gone into the loan market, clearly in an attempt for quick fix, it hasn't worked, so now they've waited for the EFL transfer window to open, lets see what if anything in terms of player they bring in.

[goody2449]

what has there experience bought us?? 2 wins in 17??? brilliant!!!

[nickbrod]

Sensible comments from forevertufc. Although time and points available are running out I'm still behind Owers and Kuhl to do the business. Their transfer dealings are crucial. Maybe tomorrow will bring some good news.

[Dave]

Read the opinions in my post fully, and then considered this. Would Lewis Hamilton win the F1 world title in a bubble car.

[nickbrod]

You can't make an omelette without eggs!

[Yorkieandy]

Read the opinions in my post fully, and then considered this. Would Lewis Hamilton win the F1 world title in a bubble car.

No. That's what makes F1 such a joke and what also makes Hamilton not really a top class driver. There is no competition.

Anyway back on goals. Owers & Kuhl need to get in some decent players but are they available? Will they come to Torquay if so? Will sufficient funds be made available by owners who (IMO) want the club relegated? The answer i'm sure will be NO to all.

GI showed their hand by taking ages to appoint O&K and then not giving them the freedom to go out and get whoever they wanted in order for the club to climb the table. The result of doing things on the cheap again is needing 4 wins as it stands without any other team above getting points in order to just climb out of the bottom 4. Bed and lie in thanks to club killers GI.

[merse btpir]

.......no real point in encouraging your team to swing 20 plus early crosses in the area, if you haven't got a player/players capable of consistently getting the ball into the right areas, because you still aren't going to score goals, there's also no real point in swinging cross after cross into the box, if you don't have a Sill's/Rendell type player, with the consistent ability to make the runs, to get onto the right areas, and finish it off, because you still aren't going to score goals.

As for crossing at every opportunity; well no ~ not in my view. That would have been futile on Saturday at Boreham Wood with thier defence built around man-mountain Dave Stephens and us with Keating and Reid spearheading the attack and their physical disadvantages against him. Better by far to play the ball up short to them in an attempt to lure Stephens out to where he could be rolled and turned. But no-one was doing that; instead they were playing balls though to our pair who were playing far too far apart to operate as a genuine pair. We might as well gone with just Reid on his own up front and an extra midfield man.

As I said before, too much impatience in getting the ball into the box is inefficient and that was our problem opnce again on Saturday. The ball needed to be moved faster and more accurately; too many touches on the ball slowed and even halted momentum and gave the opposition time to get back and re-group which they were doing with ease.

[tomogull]

I have been ranting for about two seasons for a variation of the corner routine. Instead of lumping the ball into the middle time after time, why not try a short corner routine now and then? It has worked aganist us several times! There was a game fairly recently when George Dowling (I think) was unmarked just outside the area for a corner. He had his arm up for the ball but no - it was pumped into the scrum in the penalty box. If we have 'coaching staff with experience that Owers and Kuhl have, coupled with their playing careers', why the hell can't they see it?

It IS time to judge Owers & Kuhl. They have had long enough to change things to how they think the game should be played and they are failing badly. Any players they bring in now - more than halfway through the season - will be players not performing for their current clubs. As for the 'dug turd' they've inherited, it is interesting that week after week, players at the club when Owers was appointed have figured prominently in the Player-of-the-Match thread. If you check back, you will find that McGinty, Davis, Young, Lathrope and Reid appear regularly and the posters are just as knowledgable about what they have seen as the rest of us - more so than those who mostly judge performances from grimy videl footage. The only other players that regularly get a mention are Dorel, Efete and Dowling before he picked up his injury.

[SBP]

I think that some posters feel that Owers should be judged after he has recruited his own players. I didn't see Roy Hodgson bringing players into Palace before he turned results around. He had to work with what he had. Owers knew what the situation was when he arrived. Owers and Kuhl are judged on performances and results. Performances have been poor and we have been losing. People are quick to criticise players and rightly so however Owers seems to be void of criticism.
Well they need to win probably 10 games. However if they fail and we go down it wont be there fault because they inherited a poor squad, I can hear the excuses now.

[Yorkieandy]

It's difficult though when you are working with people behind the scenes who have no intention of seeing TUFC become a successful club on and off the pitch (IMO). Perhaps that's why the appointment of O&K took so long? GI wanted someone who would 'buy in' to their plans without making much of a song and dance about it when it goes tits up. Employing a manager of the Martin Allen mould or someone of that ilk which the club were crying out for at the the time of Nico's departure would have surely meant friction between those types of managers (managers who take no sh*t and want to succeed) and GI who aren't at the club to see it do well. Again, just my opinion. Not fact.

That said though i agree with what SBP said. They knew the deal before taking the job and they aren't up to it for whatever reason. Whether it's because they have a remit to keep the club down with the dead men i don't know but i wouldn't rule it out completely. We'll never know i guess. Something isn't right though. To be rock bottom of a league that contains such luminaries as Guiseley and Fylde (with all due respect) means to me that there is something fishy down at TQ1 and it's not the smell from trawlers coming into Brixham harbour.

There is only so much blaming of previous regimes you can do before having to accept that the current one is far worse.

Thea put her money in without question and wanted the best for the club and it's fans. It backfired spectacularly but we knew her intentions were of kind heart. GI?

I'm sorry but if you cannot keep a club like Torquay above 4 others in this league then you don't really deserve to work in football again.

[merse btpir]

It's difficult though when you are working with people behind the scenes who have no intention of seeing TUFC become a successful club on and off the pitch (IMO).

I think once you set your stall out like that there is no point in arguing with you........

That's your entrenched opinion taking no notice of the weekly injections of capital and the considerable work being done on the development infrasttructure of the club; that simply wouldn't be happening if there was no intention.

The owner either needs it to be successful to re-visit his ambition to re-locate it with a better hand of cards than he had before, or he needs it to be successful to make it a viable propasition as a saleable commodity in order to re-coup his current (and growing) investment.

As much as I am going to maintain my desire to alert everyone to each and every move of Gaming International and Clarke Osborne, I would sooner have a businesslike running of the club than the dopey-bollocks naivety of a benefactor with not a clue that she was being milked for all she was worth; and even less of a clue as to how to turn that situation around.

[Dave]

Oh so we're now comparing TUFC to Crystal Palace, I'm mean, sure Lathrope, Chaney, Higgins etc are in the same class as;
Loftus-Cheek, Townsend, Zaha and Cabaye, only a matter of dropping De Boer's total football, and re-organising them in a more workman like style of football they were comfortable with., as proved by big Sam, who turned them around in the same manner.

Some also seem to forget Owers inherited a team that hadn't won any of their first ten games, conceding 23 goals along the way. Of course Owers can see the problems, there's only so much time you can spend trying coach an idiot, why does anyone think there's a few players going out, and some coming in, not saying he's the man for the job, I'll judge him on transfers and what happens after wards.

[SuperNickyWroe]

I think that some posters feel that Owers should be judged after he has recruited his own players. I didn't see Roy Hodgson bringing players into Palace before he turned results around. He had to work with what he had. Owers knew what the situation was when he arrived. Owers and Kuhl are judged on performances and results. Performances have been poor and we have been losing. People are quick to criticise players and rightly so however Owers seems to be void of criticism.
Well they need to win probably 10 games. However if they fail and we go down it wont be there fault because they inherited a poor squad, I can hear the excuses now.

brilliant logic.
compare a premier league club with international players and a manager trying to play "total sexy football" to TUFC.....

EDIT - Just read Dave's (Forevertufc's) great post above....

[tomogull]

There are some very good management and coaching teams in this league ~ Gary Waddock and his staff at Aldershot; Ian Baird ~ the Head Coach at Sutton ~ is very good, and Luke Garrard's coaching set up at Boreham Wood is well known to me. Then there are Neil Smith and Mark Hammond at Bromley; more intuitive and highly achieving coaches within the limitations of the budgets they have to work with.

From the old school doing extremely well are Alan Devonshire at Maidenhead and Chris Kinnear at Dover ~ and I've only touched on those in the south east of whom I'm a little familiar with their set-ups.....and it won't get any less demanding in National South because that too is a very professional and high thinking league as regards preparing on the training ground towards the opposition is concerned and we cannot afford to get distracted by the spectacular decline in playing facilities and spectator/media accommodation in comparison to the National League.........look at the clubs emerging from there and how well they are doing: Bromley, Boreham Wood, Sutton, Maidenhead, Maidstone, Eastleigh; and there are others

It's easy to 'cherry-pick' managers of teams that are doing reasonably well. You could have just as easily mentioned John Askey, manager of Macclesfield. A so-called club 'legend' as a player, he was appointed manager in 2013. Like Torquay, the club is in financial turmoil and whilst Askey has been in charge, they have finished about mid-table or below, although they did reach the F.A. Trophy final last season. Yet those in charge at Macclesfield have stuck with him and the club are now reaping the benefits as they are currently six points ahead at the top of the table.

You could argue that he kept Macclesfield around mid-table, but like the clubs in the London area you mention, he has the opportunity of picking up players in the Manchester area. My point is - the club stuck with him which has given the club stability.

[SBP]

brilliant logic.
compare a premier league club with international players and a manager trying to play "total sexy football" to TUFC.....

EDIT - Just read Dave's (Forevertufc's) great post above....

Where did i compare Palace to TUFC?? I was providing an example of a manager who managed to turn results around with working with what he had available.