The Play Offs

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hector
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The Play Offs

Post by hector » 20 May 2017, 21:02

Millwall's promotion shows the nonsense of the play-offs in their current guise. 9pts below Scunny and Fleetwood and nearer the relegation zone than the Champions and with a measly goal difference.

An odious fan base as well.


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Post by hector » 21 May 2017, 22:30

I notice Huddersfield finished with a goal difference of -2.

If they get promoted, does anyone know if they will be the first team with a negative goal difference to do so?


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Post by SenorDingDong » 21 May 2017, 23:14

hector wrote:
21 May 2017, 22:30
I notice Huddersfield finished with a goal difference of -2.

If they get promoted, does anyone know if they will be the first team with a negative goal difference to do so?
Huddersfield did throw their last 4/5 games though. Once they were safely within the playoffs, they switched off in favour of resting players. Wouldn't surprise me if other teams had gone up with negative goal differences however.


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Post by merse btpir » 22 May 2017, 07:52

Huddersfield's manager David Wagner had the common sense to realise that with Brighton and Newcastle having flown the nest and wrapping up the top two automatic promotion places, he had a mini-knockout competition to prepare for with a small squad with which to do it and so professionally rested, refreshed and prepared that squad.

Huddersfield have yet to play in the Premier League since it's inception and if they qualify; will be one of the smaller communities to support top flight football. Good luck to them!

When people stop whingeing and realise that after so many years this is a knockout tournament added on to the season to provide a repechage place for all those clubs who might qualify for it and thus increase and extend season to the interest of the fans; they'll stop being so bloody negative and realise that the knockouts are for an extra promotion place after all.


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Post by Gulliball » 22 May 2017, 14:49

The play-offs are great, and I'm quite surprised that support for them isn't higher. They keep the season alive for a lot of teams for a lot longer, and for that reason alone are worthwhile. If you are mid table at Christmas, as by definition the most teams are, you aim to scrape into the play-offs. This keeps interest (and so crowds + gate receipts) up in the later half of the season. I can't think of anything worse than being in the bottom half after 10 games and knowing your season is over by October as you're not going to make the top 2 or 3. Football is ultimately an entertainment, and the play-offs help to keep this alive.

You might not think it is fair that you get 10 or whatever points more than another side, but don't get an advantage, but the rules are in place before the season starts. If the top 2 go up automatically and you finish 3rd then it's not unfair that you go into the play-offs against the sides finishing 4th-6th. Personally, I like the current format as well, with a two-legged semi and then the final. You can't have it weighted too heavily in favour of the highest place finishers - if finishing 7th in the Conference as proposed means that you're unlikely to get promoted then you might as well just keep it as the top 5 and give all four sides an equal chance.

They also give fans some of the best experiences they'll ever get. Imagine being a Torquay fan without the Blackpool penalty shootout, or the Tim Sills header, or Rodney Jack destroying Scarborough.

Had they been around in say 1959/60, you wouldn't have had Torquay finishing 2nd to Ipswich on the final day and that's that, 60 years later and fans are still taking about what might have been. That side, possibly the best ever Torquay United side, would have had a chance to enter the play-offs, possibly get to Wembley and get into the 2nd tier, giving thousands of fans the best day of their lives rather than grumbling about how close we came.
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Post by Gullscorer » 22 May 2017, 16:41

No, sorry, but the play-offs are still not fair. Promotion should depend on a team's performance over the whole season, not on a handful of knockout games at the season's end. If you want to maintain the interest of all clubs right up to the last day, abolish play-offs and have a system of eight up and eight down. That way, everyone's involved.. :-)


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Post by Gulliball » 22 May 2017, 16:56

If you come 3rd in League One, or 4th in League Two or 2nd in the Conference, you know you're not getting promoted automatically. There's nothing unfair at all about these sides contesting the play-offs. Their league position is based on the whole season (and prize money etc), and to get promoted they then have to meet the conditions set out before a ball was kicked, and win the play-offs.
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Post by Plainmoor78 » 22 May 2017, 17:44

Gulliball wrote:
22 May 2017, 14:49
The play-offs are great, and I'm quite surprised that support for them isn't higher. They keep the season alive for a lot of teams for a lot longer, and for that reason alone are worthwhile. If you are mid table at Christmas, as by definition the most teams are, you aim to scrape into the play-offs. This keeps interest (and so crowds + gate receipts) up in the later half of the season. I can't think of anything worse than being in the bottom half after 10 games and knowing your season is over by October as you're not going to make the top 2 or 3. Football is ultimately an entertainment, and the play-offs help to keep this alive.

You might not think it is fair that you get 10 or whatever points more than another side, but don't get an advantage, but the rules are in place before the season starts. If the top 2 go up automatically and you finish 3rd then it's not unfair that you go into the play-offs against the sides finishing 4th-6th. Personally, I like the current format as well, with a two-legged semi and then the final. You can't have it weighted too heavily in favour of the highest place finishers - if finishing 7th in the Conference as proposed means that you're unlikely to get promoted then you might as well just keep it as the top 5 and give all four sides an equal chance.

They also give fans some of the best experiences they'll ever get. Imagine being a Torquay fan without the Blackpool penalty shootout, or the Tim Sills header, or Rodney Jack destroying Scarborough.

Had they been around in say 1959/60, you wouldn't have had Torquay finishing 2nd to Ipswich on the final day and that's that, 60 years later and fans are still taking about what might have been. That side, possibly the best ever Torquay United side, would have had a chance to enter the play-offs, possibly get to Wembley and get into the 2nd tier, giving thousands of fans the best day of their lives rather than grumbling about how close we came.
:goodpost:

And I fully agree with the point you made in your following post.


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Post by Jerry » 22 May 2017, 18:27

Plainmoor78 wrote:
22 May 2017, 17:44
Gulliball wrote:
22 May 2017, 14:49
The play-offs are great, and I'm quite surprised that support for them isn't higher. They keep the season alive for a lot of teams for a lot longer, and for that reason alone are worthwhile. If you are mid table at Christmas, as by definition the most teams are, you aim to scrape into the play-offs. This keeps interest (and so crowds + gate receipts) up in the later half of the season. I can't think of anything worse than being in the bottom half after 10 games and knowing your season is over by October as you're not going to make the top 2 or 3. Football is ultimately an entertainment, and the play-offs help to keep this alive.

You might not think it is fair that you get 10 or whatever points more than another side, but don't get an advantage, but the rules are in place before the season starts. If the top 2 go up automatically and you finish 3rd then it's not unfair that you go into the play-offs against the sides finishing 4th-6th. Personally, I like the current format as well, with a two-legged semi and then the final. You can't have it weighted too heavily in favour of the highest place finishers - if finishing 7th in the Conference as proposed means that you're unlikely to get promoted then you might as well just keep it as the top 5 and give all four sides an equal chance.

They also give fans some of the best experiences they'll ever get. Imagine being a Torquay fan without the Blackpool penalty shootout, or the Tim Sills header, or Rodney Jack destroying Scarborough.

Had they been around in say 1959/60, you wouldn't have had Torquay finishing 2nd to Ipswich on the final day and that's that, 60 years later and fans are still taking about what might have been. That side, possibly the best ever Torquay United side, would have had a chance to enter the play-offs, possibly get to Wembley and get into the 2nd tier, giving thousands of fans the best day of their lives rather than grumbling about how close we came.
:goodpost:

And I fully agree with the point you made in your following post.
Yep, and as Merse alludes to above, it's not a case of teams being denied their "rightful" promotion but actually giving them a second chance after they have failed at the first attempt.


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Post by Plainmoor78 » 22 May 2017, 20:00

If it is to be argued that the play offs are unjust then our promotion in 2009 was unjust and we didn't deserve to take our place in the football league.

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