Torquay v Hartlepool 28/10/17

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forevertufc
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Torquay v Hartlepool 28/10/17

Post by forevertufc » 29 Oct 2017, 21:39

The good old subject of time wasting in football, this one does make my laugh. It amazes me how just about every fan, of every club hates time wasting, unless, of course, their own team are doing it. Listened to the Ebbsfleet commentary Tuesday, only heard fleet fans booing for time wasting, probably the most hypocritical subject in the game.

There's is only one way to stop time wasting in football, it isn't yellow cards, because no referee will book the same player twice in a match for it regardless, it's simple, make sure your the team winning, then you've earned the right to do it.

We all like to see our team play , pleasing to the eye football, Hartlepool aren't the best team to watch, but they've got 16 points more than us, maybe we can learn from this. Stating the obvious, but we have to start winning games, and now, sod style, right now I don't care how we play, as long as the team wins.


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Post by gullintwoplaces » 30 Oct 2017, 11:09

forevertufc wrote:
29 Oct 2017, 21:39
The good old subject of time wasting in football, this one does make my laugh. It amazes me how just about every fan, of every club hates time wasting, unless, of course, their own team are doing it. Listened to the Ebbsfleet commentary Tuesday, only heard fleet fans booing for time wasting, probably the most hypocritical subject in the game.

There's is only one way to stop time wasting in football, it isn't yellow cards, because no referee will book the same player twice in a match for it regardless, it's simple, make sure your the team winning, then you've earned the right to do it.

We all like to see our team play , pleasing to the eye football, Hartlepool aren't the best team to watch, but they've got 16 points more than us, maybe we can learn from this. Stating the obvious, but we have to start winning games, and now, sod style, right now I don't care how we play, as long as the team wins.
No team has “earned the right” for members of its bench to run and take the ball when an opposition player is about to pick it up for a throw in, then to chuck it away twenty yards in the other direction. That is a major reason for my dislike of teams like Hartlepool. If that is an “earned right” then God help us.


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Post by Arrywithnobrain » 30 Oct 2017, 12:07

Football should follow the example set by most other (more enlightened) sports e.g. Rugby (Union & League), Hockey (Ice & Field), American Football, Basketball etc etc and have an off field timekeeper/clock which would pause whenever the ball is not actively in play. The time lost retrieving footballs for throw-ins or goal-kicks, together with that spent on meaningless late substitutions would become irrelevant, as would the ritual of injured players walking off the pitch after treatment in order that the referee can immediately wave them back on to the field. Yellow cards for timewasting would become a thing of the past and two thirty minute halves would mean an hour of actual football instead of the twenty minutes or so that we actually get at present.


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Post by merse btpir » 30 Oct 2017, 14:11

I think the whole thing about intelligent running of the clock down and effectively managing a game is much ado about nothing......if you don't want to be on the wrong end of it, make sure you're in the lead!

Don't lecture me about rugby with all it's stoppages for persistent rule infringements and basketball and American Football with their time outs; there's not much wrong with football!


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Post by Arrywithnobrain » 30 Oct 2017, 17:18

arrywithanh: watch, or better still play a game of hockey, at international level - you will find that the umpires do not control the time. If you do not know what you are talking about: shut up or are you acknowledging that it is you that has no brain? You will find in hockey that the nature of the game is different from football - did you realise that they use sticks rather than feet to hit the ball - and being a faster game with rolling substitutions and passes to oneself instead of throw-ins when the ball goes out of play there is intrinsically less opportunity or need for time-wasting. Unfortunately you obviously did not understand the point that I was making, even though I thought that it was written in simple enough English even for you: with an off the field official maintaining the clock, the referee is relieved of that responsibility and there becomes no need for arbitrary assessments of the length of time that it takes to make a substitution or treat in injured player etc. The lawmakers would decide what was considered to be active play and what required the clock to stop: if they considered retrieving a ball to be an active part of the game there could be no complaint about the time wasted doing it.

merse: you pontificate about football to the extent that I wonder why you are not a senior figure at the F.A., or perhaps you are - you are certainly full of enough hot air to be one. There is a lot wrong with football and its administrators as you well know, not least its unwillingness to learn from examples in other sports. You may not enjoy Rugby or American Football, possibly because you do not understand their technicalities but that is no reason to dismiss innovations that could be introduced from such sports, merely because they do not conform to your long established pre-conceived ideas. I thought that the dinosaurs became extinct a long time ago but obviously some are still alive and well in football administration: from your comment you appear to one.


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Post by merse btpir » 30 Oct 2017, 18:00

Football is a simple game; it does not need knobs trying to make it a less simple one.

The beauty of the beautiful game is that the laws apply equally to a scratch game played on dirt in Africa by bare footed players as they do to the World Cup Final played on the most sumptuous of turf in a large stadium.

If you want clocks that stop, sirens that sound and endless breaks to watch a replay on a TV monitor then leave football alone!


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Post by Dazza » 30 Oct 2017, 18:03

Don't agree with either of you! No need to be rude 'arry . Merse you werent there so you don't know how particularly ineffective this official is in this regard. He was exactly the same in an earlier game this season. Shouts a lot, waves his arms a lot but somehow manages to communicate no contol of the situation on this at all - so Hartlepool took the piss. We were 0-2 down and can't score so in real terms it was academic but he was hopeless in this respect.


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Post by portugull » 30 Oct 2017, 18:03

I would like to make one point about Saturday. When the Hartlepool player sustained a facial injury, possibly a broken nose, soon after half time the delay was at least 3 or 4 minutes for this one stoppage alone.
There were 6 substitutions and yet the added time was 4 minutes.
In the Premier League I have noticed added time is going up often 7,8 and 9 minutes.
I would favour taking the responsibility away from the match officials and having a time keeper who can accurately keep a record rather than the present system of guesswork because that is what it is guesswork.


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Post by westyorkshiregull » 30 Oct 2017, 18:12

Running the clock down for me is no issue, I would hate too see a big clock stop everytime ball was out of play or when deemed the other team was time wasting. For me it's tactical and sometimes it doesn't always pay off anyway for the team winning. It would create a worse atmosphere with the crowd as when a team does time waste we maybe would shout ECT to hurry up.
Best word I can find is artificial, as it takes away from the prerogative of the team winning to determine the tempo of what they are doing. The time added on is a minimum anyhow so I assume the ref has a degree of common sense with adding a bit more on. There is nothing wrong with how the game is now , let's not go into the formula one route and try and change something that didn't need changing and end up with a product that is boring.
Just my opinion!! Also I don't see much wrong with football apart from the money that is blown upwards and the vast millions wasted. I'm not agreeing with merse just because I actually thoughley enjoy his posts on btpir and i enjoy someone who a thought out opinion which sometimes i agree with and sometimes I don't. But I think suggesting someone has no brain is rather pathetic and shows how immature you are.


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Post by lucy6lucy » 30 Oct 2017, 18:36

portugull wrote:
28 Oct 2017, 19:27
We absolutely ran Hartlepool ragged in the first half. Two moments defined the game. McQuoid made room for a shot from 20 yards and Loach pulled off a magnificent one handed save low to his left. A few minutes later Higgins who saw a lot of the ball sent in a perfect cross to Keating in the middle of the 6 yard box,must be a goal, but somehow Keating headed wide of the right hand post.Terrible miss.
We moved the ball quickly and pressed Hartlepool who played a high line which kept the lino very busy. Hartlepool are another horrible defensive side with little quality but defend very well.
The start of the second half saw United lose all momentum with Ledger sustaining a facial injury.At least 4 minutes.
On 54 minutes a great cross from the left a d Oates gets his head on the ball fron 3 yards a split second before Dorel and we are behind.
The second goal was a cruel deflection.
George Dowling was excellent when he came on. A gifted player at a very young age far better than Evans.
In 18 League games we have failed to score in 7 games and scored just once in 7 more. This is our promlem.
Mike Fondop -Talom scored the winner for Guiseley who are improving under Paul Cox.
Gary has to find a striker as Murphy and McQuoid have scored just 2 goals between them. Not good enough.
:goodpost: Pretty much spot on with your assessment of the game, I came away not angry we had lost, more angry that we should have won this game with a natural goal scorer. We didn't play poorly, just inept up front. GO is well aware. Smash and grab win for Hartlepool
Lucy


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Post by portugull » 30 Oct 2017, 20:10

Smash and grab sums it up very well lucy.
Just watched the highlights on the OS and yet again I noticed Reid when on the bi line smashes the ball so hard across the box that Keating had little chance to convert. Calmer calmer Jamie. Final ball must be better.


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Post by Dazza » 30 Oct 2017, 20:28

Not a believer in low hard crosses then.! Calmer,calmer normally results in a hoof clear by the centre back..


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Post by TUST_Member_Rob » 30 Oct 2017, 22:12

We have seen how one good striker - k. Moore for example - can turn a team

We would have been out of sight with a decent striker on Saturday


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Post by Arrywithnobrain » 30 Oct 2017, 22:43

merse btpir wrote:
30 Oct 2017, 18:00
Football is a simple game; it does not need knobs trying to make it a less simple one.

The beauty of the beautiful game is that the laws apply equally to a scratch game played on dirt in Africa by bare footed players as they do to the World Cup Final played on the most sumptuous of turf in a large stadium.

If you want clocks that stop, sirens that sound and endless breaks to watch a replay on a TV monitor then leave football alone!
Oh Merse: Are you suggesting that football will introduce these changes of its own volition or did you forget to insert a negative at the appropriate juncture? Surely not the latter, for we all know that you are infallible and do not make mistakes!

Football is certainly a simple game and would be even simpler if knobs had not introduced goal posts ... crossbars ... referees who did not only make decisions when requested ( your ego would have struggled in those days wouldn't it Merse - having to actually wait for someone to ask for your opinion ) ... floodlights ... goal-line technology ... Sorry you were only talking about the laws of the game weren't you. Of course that scratch game in Africa adheres to the same laws as the World Cup Final: presumably your old mates Pele and Bobby Charlton were there watching it with you - which version of fantasy football do you consider to be the beautiful game? I suspect that those bare footed players are not overly concerned about the intricacies of the offside law or making sure that they have retreated the requisite distance for a free kick awarded by a zealous official and it is unlikely that they will be affected by any other laws introduced to improve the game at its highest levels. You are fully aware that In terms of laws and needs there is no correlation between football played at a professional level and the amateur kickabout that you cite so please do not make such ingenuous assertions.


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Post by merse btpir » 30 Oct 2017, 22:47

You certainly live up to your posting name; a waste of time and effort debating with you ~ goodnight!

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