Torquay United v Maidenhead, Match Day Thread 03/10/17

Matchday topics and fixtures/results stored here.
merse btpir
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Post by merse btpir »

MellowYellow wrote: 02 Oct 2017, 20:10.... there should be clear cut benefits to being a full-time professional football player training 5 days a week with recovery time built in, in terms of game development and the subsequent success of the club. Our lack of success or dam right failure ought to be continually questioned and scorned upon as we sit bottom of the league in another relegation dog-fight after 13 matches with no wins, even against clubs with part-time structures.
The very questions I'd have been putting to Nicholson if I were Harrop or Osborne ~ just what were they getting for their money?
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Post by MellowYellow »

If we don't win against Maidenhead, they may have to be asking the very same questions to Ower's too.
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Post by tomogull »

merse btpir wrote: 02 Oct 2017, 06:34 No; Luke Garrard was highly qualified as a coach when he got the Boreham Wood manager's job. He was (and still is) the Head of Academy and Assistant Manager to Ian Allinson.

He was originally an Academy Coach at the Club in 2008, before being promoted to Academy Director in 2012. Luke was the appointed Ian Allinson’s Assistant in 2013, a position he held for two-and-a-half-years. Upon Ian’s Departure in October 2015, Luke was appointed as First Team Manager.

He has been at Boreham Wood since January 2010. During his time as an academy coach at the club, Luke played a key role in helping to make the make PASE Academy become the biggest and most successful of its kind in Non-League Football....I think you would call that a time served apprenticeship of a well run club that is agreeably not a basket case; indeed if you look at the growth and development of nearby Stevenage you would see a similar rise from the lower reaches of the Ishmian League and a story repeated again at Bromley ~ all clubs who have a business plan far in excess of relying on levels of gate support.
The thing is, we could go on bickering on here until the cows come home - we probably already have - but we will never come close to an agreement because we're poles apart. I think our main difference is the emphasis we place on how what is happening off the field affects what is happening on the field. I will agree with you on one thing, though. I think Nicho was ill advised to regularly post on Facebook. It may be okay for a U.S. president to be obsessed with social media, but not a football manager (not that I'm saying Nicho was obsessed with it). It would be interesting to know how many managers do use Facebook/Twitter, though.

My views (which you will not agree with) - (a) Nicho should have been given three or four more games to get us out of the mess we were in. We may have even gained a few more points than the present paltry 5, and maybe even won a game - we shall never know; (b) I don't buy into the views that Nicho signed a crop of injury-prone players. Most of us were reasonably happy that he was bringing some experience to the team. The downside to this is that older players usually carry little 'niggles', and when they do pick up an injury, it takes them longer to recover than younger players. I think, just as Exeter last season (when some fans were calling for Tisdale's head), we have been unfortunate in picking up a long list of injuries. The debilitating illness of Jordan Lee was a real hammer blow. (c) For me, Nicho over-achieved by keeping us in the National League against the level of the toxic mess that was going on behind the scenes (d) I now think that, for his own well being, Nicho's dismissal was probably the best thing that could have happened to him to get him away from the Plainmoor 'off the field' shambles. I wish him 'good luck' wherever Fate will lead him next.

Clubs that are a mess off the field (and I'm sure we can agree that TUFC is a total mess off the field) fail. We have seen it at Plainmoor with Dave Webb and Chris Roberts. There are recent examples of other clubs - York, Hartlepool, Leyton Orient (although now under new ownership), Chesterfield and YorkieAndy mentioned Sunderland in a recent post. Now, I don't know what is happening at Sunderland, but for a side relegated from the Premier Division with a generous 'parachute payment' to be now next to bottom in the Championship, something must be seriously wrong. I will back Gary Owers and Martin Kuhl to the hilt, but I fear that whilst the club remains such a basket case, they have got a huge uphill struggle ahead of them. Time will tell ....... There - that's me done. I will try not to mention Nicho again ....... ;-)
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Post by Bristol_Gull »

1-0 to TQY

It’s almost impossible to predict who will score at the moment but I’ll go with Murphy!
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Post by nickbrod »

Sorry Tomogull but we 'only' have 4 points not 5! But after tonight 7??
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Post by Nick Potkins »

Just leaving to make the 400 mile round trip. The sun is out, the sky is blue, Torquay United we love you.

Three points a must tonight.
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Post by tomogull »

nickbrod wrote: 03 Oct 2017, 08:16 Sorry Tomogull but we 'only' have 4 points not 5! But after tonight 7??
Oh dear, Nickbrod - it's even worse than I thought. :'( Maybe it will be 5 after tonight. Actually, I agree with you - I think it will be 7 after tonight. By the law of averages, we must win sometime ....... and I feel it in my water that it will be tonight.
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Post by Yorkieandy »

Tomo makes some great points. Firstly regarding facebook / twitter. Football managers shouldn't be using social media IMO. I am an advocate of greater communication for sure but constantly putting stuff on these platforms devalues peoples opinions eventually and they end up meaning nothing, an outcome i'm sure Nico would have wished to avoid. As for the president of the USA using twitter like an angry adolescent, well, i find this both quite astonishing and at the same time sad for the future of the human race. Some professions should retain their dignity and abstain from using social media as it's inappropriate and inflammatory.

We have now have the new generation of teenagers / young twenties who probably think that posting anything and everything on social media 24/7 is the 'norm' and it's all they've ever known. The line between things that should be posted and things that should be kept private has vanished. Maybe Trump wants to be 'down with the kids' but the fact remains he has no brain.

When you take to social media as a football manager to defend yourself then it's wise that you have something valid worth defending. His record as manager of the club despite all the mitigating circumstances was atrocious but fans don't look at 'mitigating cirumstances' they just look at results and the league table. The fact that he carried on in the job despite many hurdles to overcome and with no help or support suggests that for him it was about love for the club rather than money. He can't have been on much i presume.

Unlike previous managers who were total shite at their jobs (Alan Knill & Chris Hargreaves) they at least had guaranteed work after management at Torquay. I've no idea what Nico will do now but it certainly won't be a job at a club higher up than Torquay are at the moment. I do have respect for Nico both as a person and a manager but i have absolutely no respect for the aforementioned two in either capacity.

Nico should have been kept in the post during the month when GI seeked a new manager. For all that Nico can partly be culpable for the standard of the squad he left behind, the knockout blow was that wasted month of drifting aimlessly without any management and chucking aaway points and with them any hope of survival. This highlights the point that when you have owners who hinder rather than help then you're on a hiding to nothing. GI continued to hinder the club for a full month after and Nico wasn't even at the club. Shall we blame him anyway?

In the 6 games since his departure including 3 with Owers / Kuhl there hasn't yet been a win. Despite adding a number of new players. The new manager bounce has failed the club once again and increased the pressure.

The points tomo and myself have made about the correlation between clubs who slide down the leagues alarmingly and the manner in which they are run is a pertinent one. I said on here a few times at the start of last season that York will go down again because to anyone who knew the workings of that club it was an inevitability. No matter which managers they brought in or how many players, there was a disease there, a negativity, a clear lack of direction that permeated through the whole place.

Sure there is no obvious reason why a badly run club can't get in a decent proven manager, sign a load of higher calibre players and climb the league. Common sense tells you that is the most likely scenario except for some reason this frequently fails to happen and once that initial honeymoon period fails to materialize things get sticky and everyone gets further bogged down. I'm not really a spiritual man but on the face of it you can only explain it as like a huge invisible bubble of negative bad energy that engulfs the whole club and traps it into a spiral downwards. When you have disinterested owners then eventually that apathy and lack of direction will ensure a heavy price is paid.

It is happening to Chesterfield currently for sure and exactly like York and Torquay the signs have been there quite starkly for a couple of years now and with the club still being run in the same manner there is only one direction it can go in. They've had loads of managers, loads of players and now have appointed club legend and ex player Jack Lester as manager (ala Hargreaves) yet nothing seems to work. Lester lost his opening game at home to Cheltenham at the weekend. Appointing Lester is the nail in the CFC coffin.

York's owner isn't in the slightest bit interested in improving the football club and continues to keep it ticking along in the same failing way and does so bizarrely not realizing that is the main problem as to why the club find themselves the big cheese in NLN yet still struggling. They have just sacked boss Gary Mills for the second time (another mistake re-appointing him) and given the job to Darlington manager Martin Gray.

Chesterfield's owner isn't interested in improving the football club. Reports suggest he and Chris Turner have done very well out of their brief successful period and have now left the club to rot and put it up for sale. Only at a vastly inflated price rendering it out of the price range for most investors to even consider. Rumours abound of the owner wanting to use the land at Sheffield Road for apartments and a casino. In the meantime, like at Torquay, the club drifts aimlessly with no clear direction and with owners whose interest lies elsewhere.

Torquay we know about. Owners who aren't interested in the football club or talking to and improving the lot for Torquay fans. With Torquay it comes off the back of previous shocking management by previous boards and as such is the killer blow. Recovery isn't possible from such an unfavourable set of circumstances.

'Failure is not a single, cataclysmic event. You don't fail overnight. Instead, failure is a few errors in judgement, repeated every day.'

JIM ROHN

The most telling theme of the last few years at Torquay is just how poisonous the club has become including an alarming number amongst the fanbase. As tomo says, he thinks it is a good move for Kevin to get the hell away from the football club for his own good and that his dismissal was the best thing that ever happened to him. This isn't the first time people associated with doing their best for the club have been told by fans that it's best they are a long way away from the place due to the lack of appreciation and ignorance from supporters.

Martin Ling. Worked wonders for us, his style of football was drab but a thoroughly decent man and who was mentally ill at the time the fortunes of the team took a nosedive. Quickly forgotten was the fact he worked through that early onset of his illness, he got the club to a play off semi and he made money for the club by finding and selling the likes of Bobby Olejnik.

Thea Bristow. Chucked millions upon millions at the football club and for nothing as it turns out in the end. Yes i am aware that she was naive as many would say but she entrusted others to use the money wisely who didn't. She wasn't a chairperson or an experienced football administrator. She was just a generous and passionate lady fan who thought her money could benefit the football club and astonishingly she still gets abuse and derided.

So when i say a football club is poisoned i mean it's from the inside out. Not just the board, the managers, the players. It can be many of the fanbase too. I know it's the same at Chesterfield with their fans. It all comes back around in the end.

Maidenhead tonight is a game Torquay should be expecting to win. They should be going all out to win and if they end up getting beat then move on. Draws aren't good enough. Hopefully the win will come tonight and that somehow can provide the all elusive spark required to gain some points and momentum.
Last edited by Yorkieandy on 03 Oct 2017, 14:28, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by desperado »

Trouble is these bloody teams raise their game when they come to us, Maidenheads first visit the impressive
stadium that is Plainmoor, for them anyway. Will be a very hard game , we simply must be good in both
penalty areas, they are a decent side without raising their game
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Post by MellowYellow »

desperado wrote: 03 Oct 2017, 14:09 Trouble is these bloody teams raise their game when they come to us, Maidenheads first visit the impressive
stadium that is Plainmoor, for them anyway. Will be a very hard game , we simply must be good in both
penalty areas, they are a decent side without raising their game
I've heard 8 of the Maidenhead players were working 4/5 hours this morning in their main occupations and rushed to catch the coach at mid-day for the 200 mile/5 hour journey to Torquay. So after a 10 hour stressful day they should be pretty knackered tonight. Unlike our professional full time 'Knights of Armour'. Should be a stroll in the park for our boys tonight - them being fit, strong having had plenty of rest and recovery time today. So on paper it should read professionals 6 - knackered part timers 0. So why on earth am I predicting 2-1 to Maidenhead?
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Post by Ottery gull »

Ten minutes to play. The Gulls 2-0 up and coasting. Full time 2-2 but a well earned point! what a load of boiiocks!
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Post by tufc si »

Maidenhead coach delayed so KO at 8.15!

Hopefully good news for us, we need all the help we can get!!!
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Post by merse btpir »

This is bollocks ~ ****' unprofessional whether the are part-time or not; once at the ground 15 minutes to get changed and get on with it then........as we had to at Sutton last season!
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Post by MellowYellow »

But that is what part time is - non professional! but come on, have a little sympathy for the Maidenhead boy's, most of them had to work till Mid-Day which still allowed an extra hour leeway for traffic on top of their 5 hour planned journey. Poor sod's will be absolutely knackered by the time they reach the field of play. Easy three points for us then. What say you?
Last edited by MellowYellow on 03 Oct 2017, 19:55, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by tufc si »

MellowYellow wrote: 03 Oct 2017, 19:50 Come on have a little sympathy for the Maidenhead boy's, most of them had to work till Mid-Day which still allowed an extra hour leeway for traffic on top of their 5 hour planned journey. Poor sod's will be absolutely knackered by the time they reach the field of play. Easy three points for us then. What say you?
3 points will be in our pockets by half-time for sure...
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