Cheltenham Town v Torquay United

[cambgull]

23 points dropped just this season? That really is terrible, we'd be top by 3 points with 2 games in hand! I know we're still in the running but we really should have taken the 3 points today, we'd have been 1 point off the play-offs with 2 games in hand and a better goal difference than anyone around us. Poor, really poor but this has been a problem since watching Torquay when I was a kid. My brother and I used to constantly joke about how we have to score as many as possible in the first 70 mins so we can hold off in the last 20.

[ferrarilover]

Well, I'm utterly despondent. 2-0 up against a side who didn't look as if they would have scored if our keeper hadn't come out for the second half and still we have been cheated out of 2 points. I will concede that PBs decisions to withdraw Billy and Robinson (who was NOT happy) were not good ones, but had it not been for the referee today, we would be away with three comfortably deserved points.
The stats show that not one of our players committed more than one foul and both teams committed the same number of fouls , yet we had 4 men booked, they didn't ever look like having a name taken.
LRT was absolutely cythed down, on the left touchline, no more than 8 feet in front of the lino, the referee saw it and gave nothing. seconds later, their geezer is caught from behind, not a good challenge, but worthy of nothing more than a free kick. Not only is the free kick awarded, but so is the bloody inevitable yellow card. Lo and behold, they score from the free kick (with Potter probably being fouled on his line).
The referee has cost us YET AGAIN. every match like this which I see convinces me further that there must be a 'referee retirement fund' to which every other club in the league makes a donation and we do not. He was so determined that Cheltenham were going to get a point that he added on 4 minutes (a lot anyway) and the stadium announcer gave the time of the goal as 90+5. Just **** ing outrageously bad refereeing, he needs reporting, but it won't get our points back, but it might save us from being subjected to him again. ****.

Matt.

[Dave]

Well what an utterly sh#te end to a great day,my first away trip for a couple of seasons which i enjoyed,great to meet up with a few from this site,and meeting brett/scotty for the first time

How can we not defend a lead ? I am lost for words ,there keeper was allowed in those last 10 minutes almost to run to the half way line ,and really did not get how that was not foul on LRT ,minutes later as said they get a free kick which questionable to say the least score from it and change the game,there second just can understand why no one back took responsibity ,the ball into are box see the danger deal with it,90+5 minutes put your boot through it knock into row z,nope we just hesitate and allow the one Cheltenham player in the box to score.

However there positives and it was another game unbeaten,great turn out from the gulls fans tonight who were in good voice.

[neutralobserver]

i understand all your frustrations, after being 2 up and drawing can often feel like a loss, but as my username indicates i was a neutral tonight and i feel that you really weren't any better than cheltenham tonight, they did have 57% possession, shots on target 8-6, off target 6-4, corners 11-5 all in their favour,fouls 8-8, i agree the referee was shocking but he was consistently bad for both teams, zebroski should have been sent off, anyway after a long drive home i'm offski now, hope the rest of your season goes well

PS, to the torquay fans who made the trip tonight, great turn out and made good noise, well done

[ferrarilover]

i understand all your frustrations, after being 2 up and drawing can often feel like a loss, but as my username indicates i was a neutral tonight and i feel that you really weren't any better than cheltenham tonight, they did have 57% possession, shots on target 8-6, off target 6-4, corners 11-5 all in their favour,fouls 8-8, i agree the referee was shocking but he was consistently bad for both teams, zebroski should have been sent off, anyway after a long drive home i'm offski now, hope the rest of your season goes well

PS, to the torquay fans who made the trip tonight, great turn out and made good noise, well done

The very nature of your post indicates that, far from being a neutral observer, you are some geezer who has gone to the BBC website, looked at the stats box and made your assumptions from there. Welcome along and all that, but for Christ's sake be honest. I'm not interested how much possession they had, they did **** all with it, poncing around at the back then lumping a ball forward or constantly feeding their strikers 30 yards out and back to goal, they posed zero threat all night. Their first goal was a foul on Potter (our keeper) and their second was a big ball forward from the keeper turned in by an outstretched boot. Potter has had one serious save to make tonight and that came about from a Guy Branston error, even then he didn't look unduly troubled by a piss poor shot.

Zebroski should have been sent off, excellent use of sources and evidence there. Since your beloved BBC stats page will tell you than not one of our players committed more than a single foul tonight, you MUST be referring to a tackle which, in your opinion (and your opinion alone, as I shall evidence momentarily) was worthy of a straight red. (Here it comes) since CTFCs "fans"** didn't shout for anything all night, especially not a foul so heinous that it was worthy of instant dismissal from the field of play, this mythical horror tackle simply cannot have existed, unless you are suggesting that the other 3000 people in the ground, and the player, staff and officials all missed it too?

Matt.

** The difference between fans and "fans" is volume, we were singing Yellow Army (cheers Paul) no more than 3 seconds after they equalised, their embarrassments however, didn't make a squeak all night.

[ferrarilover]

Smiffy,
The assertion that our defence should deal with the wrongly awarded free kick is mis-apportioned blame. If we are on top of a tall building and I push you gently and you fall off and die I will be arrested and I will go to court. If in court I plead that you should have been strong enough to resist such a gentle push and therefore it is your own fault that you fell off the building and died, would you suggest I would be found not guilty by the jury? This is the same situation, it is not for our defence to deal with a free kick which should not have been awarded, it is for the referee to make the correct (and very, very, very easy) decision in the first place. Thus, I submit it is the fault of the referee that we have conceded the first goal. This is to say nothing of what I believe to have been a foul on Potter. I'm open for video evidence to prove otherwise, but I'm pretty sure there is a foul in there as the ball comes in and possibly as the shot is made too.

Matt.

Double postage is for winners :~D

[divingbboy]

Just read this on Lee Mansell's twitter feed:

"@manse7 Lee Mansell
The Torquay fan who abused my elderly gran who came to her first game today your a **** idiot watch yourself you #%^* ."

Anybody know anything about this? He probably shouldn't be making veiled threats on a public feed, but understandable, really, if that happened.

[Regiment]

Just read this on Lee Mansell's twitter feed:

"@manse7 Lee Mansell
The Torquay fan who abused my elderly gran who came to her first game today your a f**k idiot watch yourself you #%^* ."

Anybody know anything about this? He probably shouldn't be making veiled threats on a public feed, but understandable, really, if that happened.

blimey - unless his gran was the linesman, i've no idea !!

[Regiment]

Can I just say the referee has NOT solely cost us the game. Both goals were our own terrible goalkeeping/defending, how is this the referee's fault!??

Yes the linesman and referee have criminally not blown the whistle for the horrible challenge on LRT, and everything would have happened different from that freekick had it been given... but we should be mature enough to deal with these things as a team, and continue to play as we had done for the previous 80 minutes. The goals didn't result directly from that, although I am convinced had it been given, things would have unfolded differently, and Oastler wouldn't have commited a foul as we would have had possession etc etc.... however it doesn't excuse our bad defending.

The freekick which Oastler(?) gave away prior to their first goal WAS a free kick. I'm sorry guys but he tackled from behind, and letter of the law says that this is a foul. Whether he should have been booked or not has no bearing on the matter, as the freekick would have been taken either way.

Teams get bad referees and bad decisions against them all the time, yet most league 2 teams would have dealt with that free kick simply and easily. We however headed the ball into a very awkward area, and then punched the ball straight to the feet of their player 10 yards out... our fault!

I know the referee was sh*t today in that he booked only our players etc, but their goals which cost us the points were due to our immaturity as a team. We are very naive, and don't have the resiliance or mentality needed when faced with adversity.

you make some good points, and the purpose of a forum is having a right to express an opinion, but i'm afraid i have to question the highlighted comment.

i think the point of contention here is that merely 10 seconds prior to the Oastler foul (and yes, it was a foul) LRT was hacked down in a very late challenge, right under the lino's nose, and he failed to do his job and signal to the referee for the offence and stop play. then we would've had the free kick, end of. i personally felt Oastler's challenge carried some frustration over the LRT challenge, which maybe can be attributed to his youth and inexperience, and he'll learn from that, as he otherwise had a very good game. However, inconsistency IS the fault of the officials.

[RussianGull]

Ref and Lino had a shocker.

Boys should've held firm, but as per usual we didn't, a point's a point and that's all I've got to say.

[Fletch]

I was happy with Potter before the game and he did ok, but it's now clear that Potter shouldn't be in the team simply because he isn't as good as Bevan. Good distribution may help us score goals, but that's not where the problem lies... We concede goals like there's not tomorrow. Bevan would definitely have taken that first ball easily. Potter flapped it into the path of their player who I knew had scored as soon as Potter punched it.

Easy to blame the keeper Smiffy. I thought he had only let in one in the previous 4 matches? Perhaps I was mistaken though...

There's been plenty of occasions on here when the finger has been pointed at Bevs over goals we've let in, some of them from high crosses into the box. For what its worth, I think Potter is slightly ahead on all round keeping ability. Both are good shot stoppers, Bevs slightly ahead on crosses, Potter slightly ahead on coming off his line and his distribution (usually). The fact that we had no one who could hold the ball up in the opposition half just invited pressure onto the defence and when that happens, something will give eventually.

[ferrarilover]

I don't dispute that it was a free kick for the Oastler challenge (although PB seems to think the ball was taken) I take the view that since the ball should never have been in that position in the first place, it is the fault of the referee. It would be equally as easy to argue the opposing view that regardless of what SHOULD have happened, the team should have dealt with what DID happen. As I've said, I'm not willing to lay the blame with the players for failing to deal with a grotesque refereeing error, we shall have to agree to disagree and consign this match to the annals of history.

Matt.

[Trojan 67]

How frustrating. Our inability to hold on to leads will be the difference between a promotion push and mid-table mediocrity at the end of the season. I'm not complaining with 12th, I've said all season I'd be happy if we finish around there, but if we could protect a lead we would be hunting for the title.

The facts back it up:

- Scored the first goal in 20 of our 30 matches (66.6% - higher than any other side), but only gone on to win half of them.

- Dropped 23 points from a winnng position - only lower than Cheltenham (24) who have played two extra games.

We just seem to hit the panic button and self-destruct. It's happened too many times to blame officials and the damn woodwork. I'm not sure if it's a mental thing, inexperience, bad tactics etc, but we are constantly putting ourselves in a winning position and then shooting ourselves in both feet.

As for tonight's team selection, you can't blame Buckle for keeping the back five as it was given our recent run, but Macklin? Where did that come from? I don't know how he performed but I don't understand how 'the odd one out' can leap above O'Kane, Gilligan, Stevens and even Halpin in the pecking order. He hasn't even been on the bench lately. I don't mean to criticise the player, but it was just a bizarre decision by Buckle.

This is probably a knee-jerk reaction (I wouldn't have said this at 9.20pm), but I would like to see us go back to basics on Saturday. Bring back Bevan, Nico and maybe Ellis and O'Kane. The players that have come in have performed well, but that's four points dropped from two games which we should have won.

Tommy's observation

[royalgull]

four points dropped from the last 2 games

So the other players who had been in the side, were in the team which dropped the other 19 points.

For the record, I thought Macklin did alright last night. Get the ball to his feet or for him to run onto and we see the best of him. No point asking him to challenge in the air and bully people around. He'll be a decent player in time.